Where is the self-assessment?

Not playing for your hs team doesn’t always mean a lot.  I know you have a lot of criteria there, but people see what they want to see. That said, we have a kid at our hs who has played very very little (almost zero in district). He is ranked on the top 100 draft list and is committed to a top 25 D1. I would say his potential is probably off the charts but he has not been able to throw  strikes consistently, and therefore he does not play at our high school. He will very likely be drafted this year.  Our sophomore year, there were 12 seniors on our team. Every single one of them committed to play baseball somewhere. Only three or four of them had any meaningful innings during high school. Quite a few of them played several years in college.  But the thing is, some of the kids who got cut freshman year at our high school, changed schools and started for varsity that same year at their new school. It all depends on the level of the school and if my kid loved Baseball, and could play somewhere, I would have no problem with it at all all

The short answer is no, not for most.  And in most cases, the root problem is the parents.  Told too often and too long how special and great they are.

I have a close friend with an uncommitted 2022 1B.  The kid and the dad absolutely KNOW that the kid is special and capable of D1 ball.  With every bone in their bodies, they believe that.  In the fall, the kid got one NAIA offer after a school saw him play in one game as a DH.  They visited, didn't like it (they consider NAIA where players go to "die" - that NAIA is a "dead end") but strung the coach along until December when the kid declined.  The school was done waiting.  The kid did a Juco Route showcase 2 weeks ago and generated some interest.  Visited a Juco Monday, at an NAIA as I type this, and have plans to visit another Juco and NAIA next week.  Obviously due to the calendar, none of these programs are juggernauts.  Literally no one (outside of their DNA pool) has said the kid has D1 potential. Yet they feel he does.  The kid will almost certainly choose one of the Jucos because they believe it leaves the door open for D1.  And it technically does, but in the same way buying a lottery ticket leaves winning the jackpot open.  The kid can hit pretty well, but he just ran an 8.35 60.  I'm not sure an 8.35 kid can play 1B in the field at any college level, but I also can't imagine how well an 8.35 kid will have to hit at the college level to even be able to DH.  The dad is a great guy and so is the kid.  But they see something that no one else does.  I've tried ad nauseum to explain to the dad that the market - not the family - sets the value of a kid.  But it's fallen in deaf ears.  The kid played football in the fall and completely shut down all baseball activities, so they're wrapped up in the premise that the kid would have been identified by higher levels had he been out there with regard to baseball.

I think a big problem for this family and LOTS of other players and parents is the eye ball comparison test.  They played ball with Jimmy Doe since age 8 and Jimmy got D1 offers.  They might admit that Jimmy is somewhat better, but not by much.  So it's reasonable to presume that they'll get offers somewhere near what Jimmy did.  Of course most here understand how flawed and silly that logic is, but many do not.  And never will, because when the game ends for them, the kid will have gotten "screwed."  If you hang on to the "overlooked/undervalued" mantra with a death grip, you can never truly lose.  So you're chasing a ghost in this case @Francis7.  What is obvious to you, can be completely avoided by others if they want to bad enough.

Francis, I say this with both respect and affection, as you're unquestionably one of the good guys and despite taking a month or two off, IMO you're the MVP of this website, but, that said:

What's it to you?

People make poor choices all the time. If they wanted any advice they would ask for it.

Sometimes detours are an essential part of the journey.

Francis,

Sometimes the light bulb never goes off because the light bulb has been taken out of the socket.   

Bottom line is people see and believe what they want to.   Sometimes there is nothing anybody can do as in Danj's example.

We had a kid on my son's HS varsity team, he was not a starter, went to a D3 with a very large team (i.e. didn't cut many).  Covid ended his freshman year, but sophomore year I noticed that midway through the season, he was starting.  So, he did something to make that happen.  Some guys plan to work hard when they get away from home.  Maybe they wouldn't have gone to college at all if not for baseball, and their parents are thrilled?

Some guys want an extra-curricular that is something athletic that they like, even if they don't play in games. My oldest son played rec basketball in 6th grade.  The team lost all their games, but the coaches and kids were great.  He said he loved the practices, but not the games.  There's something to be said for regularly doing an activity with a group of people.

Same argument for the 2022 who reclassed to a 2024. Very nice kid, not sure if my kid did that our father/son relationship would be intact tho.

If a kid wants to play, wants to try to play- regardless of perceived odds, I say let him have at it.  

What’s the difference between the described scenario and a kid with solid mid major potential who takes the dream school P5 offer and it doesn’t work out?  Either way self assessment was poor.

There was a kid on my son’s high school team who never got more than a handful of garbage innings and at bats. The team had a lot of depth. From my son’s junior year roster twelve players played college ball at some level including this kid.

The kid played Legion ball in the summer. Legion ball was terrible in our area. The kid went on to play at a HA D3 that didn’t win often. He graduated with his name on several of the school’s top ten all time lists.

I know a dad who left no dollar unspent from age thirteen to eighteen on his LL stud son. The kid didn’t start at a 2A (of 6A) high school. A name travel program had no problem taking the dad’s money and putting him on the C teams every year. The kid sat for four years of college ball on a very large roster. But dad brags his kid played college ball. The uninformed think of the CWS they saw on tv and say, “Wow!”

You will never get an answer to this question because the answer is different for everyone.  Even the P5 kid who is not a starter for a couple of years or never is seen as a failure by some.  Our community wants to know when my son will move to a starting pitcher role for UT.  My answer is never.  He has a role and fills it pretty good and is content in his role.  He also realizes that if he makes it to the pros that will probably still be his role despite the fact that he very rarely ever relieved or closed in HS or travel ball playing for top 10 teams nationally his entire travel ball career.

He could have gone to a mid-major and been the guy but he wanted to play in the SEC, play at Hoover and get to go to CWS.  All checked off last year.  If that is his career, some will say failure but I don't think he will.

Thanks all. To the question: What's it to me? Heck, I know it's none of my business and it impacts me in no way whatsoever. That said, I'm a pretty empathic person and I feel for the kid on what's coming down the road. No one wants that disappointment. Plus, I also know some of the parents and they are part of the problem. And, I guarantee you, when the kid gets cut or buried, it's not going to be because he's 170 pounds, is a defensive liability, throws 72 off the mound, can't hit to save his life against the lowest velos. It's going to the coaches fault, and/or the school or "bad breaks" and it will always be "I know he could be a great college player if only given a fair chance." Just seems that people could save themselves and their kid some uncomfortable events if they just got educated on the level of baseball in college and took off the blinders and gave themselves an honest evaluation.

@Francis7 posted:

Thanks all. To the question: What's it to me? Heck, I know it's none of my business and it impacts me in no way whatsoever. That said, I'm a pretty empathic person and I feel for the kid on what's coming down the road. No one wants that disappointment. Plus, I also know some of the parents and they are part of the problem. And, I guarantee you, when the kid gets cut or buried, it's not going to be because he's 170 pounds, is a defensive liability, throws 72 off the mound, can't hit to save his life against the lowest velos. It's going to the coaches fault, and/or the school or "bad breaks" and it will always be "I know he could be a great college player if only given a fair chance." Just seems that people could save themselves and their kid some uncomfortable events if they just got educated on the level of baseball in college and took off the blinders and gave themselves an honest evaluation.

In the big picture and long run, who cares? The last thing I wanted for my kids was to be left dwelling on their high school and college glory years. My kids had quality college careers. Now they’re doing more important things.

At 33 and 28 college ball is no longer relevant to them. My daughter plays on a lawyer league softball team. She’s amused by how cut throat it is. My son prefers to talk about his golf game. The real competition is in their professions.

Someday, chances are they come full circle as the kids they don’t have yet start to play sports.

When I was 23 and out of college outside work what mattered was how good of a two man beach volleyball player could I become. Other than enjoying attending the occasional MLB game I didn’t give baseball a lot of thought until my kids started playing.

Francis,

Check a bit of history on Hendrix college baseball. When our son was at Trinity (Tx) the games were totally non-competitive. TOTALLY!

One game we sat with a Hendrix pitcher’s parents. He wanted TU but knew he would not see an inning. We talked about ways Coach Scannell was building TU and approaches for parent support.

A couple years later Hendrix changed coaches and the assistant was the shortstop on the teams which got crushed. He joined the HSBBW site as doubletothegap.

We exchanged communications about his efforts to recruit and build and finding quality players who respected the game. He was very generous in how our son and teammates competed in each of those blowouts.

Long story short, double recruited a number of wonderful players and in 2010 they beat Trinity to win the SCAC and the very first Regional berth.

While I ???? a number of your posts, I completely support your empathetic feelings. I posted this to suggest that sometimes the story evolves with a highly unexpected outcome-sort of like the starting QB at UGA this year and one of our son’s best friends who walked on at ND as 9th string QB and ended up a starter for Coach Willingham.

There’s a plenty of delusion going around these days, I’m not sure parents and kids believing they’ll achieve more than what seems realistic is very high on the need to fix list. I’m going to stick with – no physical abuse, no emotional abuse, no judgment. Plus, stranger things have happened...

Of course, when a program has a winning percentage of .100 or less, there's no where to go but up. And, I know for fact that the right coach can come in and change a program from a perennial doormat to a yearly contender.

But the kids I am talking about here are not the kids who are going to turn around a program.

The 17 year old who tops out at 73, can't consistently throw strikes, and literally threw batting practice in the one varsity appearance he had as a junior in a blowout token appearance is not going to find it as a college player.

The kid with a personal best 2.3 POP who played zero varsity games as a junior and was the 4th string catcher on a mediocre HS team is not the kid who is going to get any playing time in college.

The kid who played varsity as a junior on a bad HS team and who had 3 bloop hits in 66 at bats isn't going to find it any easier at the college level.

These are not hypotheticals or exaggerations. These are three 2022s that I know and each one has verbally committed to play at a D3 after HS. Granted, it's D3 programs way at the bottom of the rankings.

And, we all know why the coaches brought them in and they will be one of 55 kids practicing in the fall. 

I woke up this morning thinking about this post and wondered what about it rubbed me the wrong way. I think it’s this:

Many parents here have had kids that are/were “wire to wire” athletes, showed an aptitude in t-ball and are/were top third of any team they’ve play/played on until they aren’t/weren’t. That wasn’t my son’s trajectory, he did show an aptitude t-ball, but he was bottom third on an exceptional travel team (12U-14U, 2 MLB debuts, 2 AAA, 5+ still working lower levels) where he was this threads topic among a few parents. These types of parents seem either too insensitive or obtuse to realize that those comment will make there way back to both the player and parent. I still know one of these dads and he has no clue he lost my respect long ago. Aside from adding fuel to my son’s desire to prove them wrong, I don’t see any good that comes from negativity or exclusivity toward other’s kids or the need to put them in an opinion based box.  

Being a good sports parent citizen is hard, there’s lots of time to interact, analyze and make mistakes. Just the dichotomy of being supportive to other parents while wanting your kid to beat someone else’s kid out for a spot is hard to rationalize. I suppose it’s human nature, but I’m not a fan of limiting dreams because unfortunately life takes care of that without any help from us.

Some see it as delusional, others a part of the grind.  In this hypothetical, I would be supportive of the parents and even if they are squandering their retirement to support their kid's futile dream.

JucoDad nailed it.  It’s too one dimensional to judge someone else’s situation and have a definitive conclusion.   It feels a hell of alot better to walk over or text one of those parents and congratulate them on reaching one of their goals.  

With a 2022 myself, each time I reach out to congratulate a family, the exchanges are heartfelt acknowledgments with the satisfaction that we are all on our journeys - in the context of this sport.

When my son was 14 I took him to practice and there was a group of 15-16 year old kids practicing with their Senior Little League team.  They weren't very good, and by the standards of competitive travel ball they were terrible.  I'm sure none of these kids were good enough to play for their HS varsity team.  One of the dads on my son's team commented "Why do they even bother...".  But you know what, they were having fun.  Sometimes we forget that having fun is the whole point of playing the game.

Let’s say a kid goes on to college ball, doesn’t get much of an opportunity and believes it was the coach’s fault. He still comes out of the experience with a valuable life lesson that could push him further in life than baseball … Life isn’t always fair.

The next step is deciding if you’re a glass half full or glass half empty person. It will determine if you spend the next forty years as a whiner by the water cooler or a problem solver moving up the ranks of the professional world.

That's kind of where I'm at with this.  There were parents who scoffed at parent's who changed schools so that their son could play ball when he wouldn't have been able to at his current school.  I'm all for it if you have the means and are able to.  There are late bloomers.  There is also a value to the friendships and feeling of team that comes with playing sports.  The road ends for everyone somewhere but if you can keep playing and still love the journey, why not?  I had a parent tell me that they didn't care if their son ever played, he just wanted to be in the dugout and be part of it.  Some kids are born with a gift and they are lucky.  Not discrediting hard work, but some kids will never get there no matter how hard they work.  It's a journey that has value regardless of playtime.

@Smitty28 - we have a men's league by me. Everyone is over 22. Hardly anyone looks good in a uniform. Some guys seem to be good candidates for a heart attack. But, God Bless them, they are out there in the summer playing ball. And, the only reason any of them do it is for fun.