Why do parents act as they do?

It is a real battle at times.
I tend to sit off by myself, or close to parents
that keep pretty calm
I find that if I am in the middle of parents that
really act out then I have a very hard time not joining in.
This also applies if the opposing team's parents are
too close and their rebel rousers can get me started. So I try to sit off alone so I do not embarrass my son or myself.

quote:

Youth sports have become very competitive, maybe not so much in our son's eyes but in ours

That is the problem.

It used to be, "let boys be boys". Parents let their kids grow up and learn things through life experiences.
Then the "Oprah Era" came along. We analyze everything, because our parents and grand parents just said, let things be. There has to be more to it than that. We are college educated, there must be more. So we analyze over and over, then we say the kids need us there for protection and building of self-esteem. So we take helicopter flying lessons so that we can learn to hover. Then we hire other professionals to give more advice and we invest time, money and sweat into attempting to make little Johnny or Mary the best they can be. We can't possibly go to work and tell our fellow workers that our kid is ordinary. He must be a star, so that we fit in with all the other star parents kids. Soon, little Johnny has a therapist, ridelin meds, a cell phone with text capability, a pitching instructor, a hitting instructor, plays on 3 travel elite teams, has a room full of trophies and is on his way to a D-1 scholarship or the draft, and he's only 7.
In the end we do most of this out of a passion for our children.
I must say though that even in todays competitve world, tell your kid that its ok to be ordinary.

quote:

How do we handle it?

We grow some maturity,....realize its not about us, and SNAP THE HECK OUT OF IT!!!

Plus, it probably wouldn't hurt for us to look up the definition of " supportive ", then tape that definition to our mouths, as we park waaaaaaaay out in center field to watch the game with binoculars.
( straight jacket optional )

We have read and heard things about youth baseball. Good and bad. I ask the question. do the kids have anything to do with the bad?

quote:

We grow some maturity,....realize its not about us, and SNAP THE HECK OUT OF IT!!! Big Grin

Yes. That's my goal, anyway. This is why I started keeping a book. I have something to keep me occupied during games. 2B has worked his way into the starting lineup at every level so far, and I've felt like he always got a fair shot and made the most of it. I do get butterflies when he comes up to bat, and for that reason I'm not looking forward to his return to pitching this year - I'll be a wreck. But as he's gotten older, I've learned that he'll do just fine, no matter what I do. It's the whispers I hear behind me (he's coach's favorite, mom is a suck-up because she volunteers, that's why he's out there instead of Johnny) that are hardest to deal with. It doesn't matter what they think, but sometimes it does get to me.

In my mind, the kids have very little to do with the bad. If they do at all, it is because of what they are learning at home.

Edit: I didn't answer the question of why I get those butterflies. I guess it is because I pull so hard for him. I want him to succeed, but not as much as he wants to. Plus, the ride home is a lot more pleasant when he's had a good day.

2BMOM,

Let that stuff go.A lot of parents say stuff like that. There is a lot of jealousy when your kid starts. Ive learned this dont justify any of it to anyone sit back and let your kid prove everyday that he belongs in the starting line up.
my son started a JC this week, 120 kids at the first baseball meeting.My son was recruited for the team, many boys are just showing up, but its going to be a dog fight none the less. My son is ready and he is prepared. He has always been prepared, thats all they can do work hard, be prepared, physically, mentally and academically.And the people who want to tear kids up behind the parents back they have existed for ever and will continue to exist. its the nature of the beast.

I don't think it has changed over the years. I recall when I played 30 to 35 years ago plenty of examples of daddy ball or yelling parents. I don't think its anything new.

Go watch the original 1976 Bad News Bears movie. I know its Hollywood and I know its just a movie, but they got some things right in this movie.

For example:
- The "Bears" team was formed as an expansion team because the league got sued because they were not making a team for weaker players that were subject to being cut in prior years.
- The good, experienced teams resented having to allow weaker player/teams in the league.
- There are examples of the dad getting on the kid and putting pressure on the kid to perform.
- The curve ball over-used at a young age and hurting an arm to win a championship.
- The coaches yelling back and forth at each other.
- The confrontation between the coaches and the league.
- The peer pressure the kids face with their classmates from being on a losing team.
- And don't forget the examples of how important it was to the kids to want to win. The kids want to play and they want to win.

Hope I didn't stray too far off topic. But, this movie is nearly 40 years old. I related to it very well as a child. I don't see much difference in today's play (outside of the introduction of travel ball.) I will admit the media coverage has changed. The media loves a good baseball confrontation.

quote:

Let that stuff go.A lot of parents say stuff like that. There is a lot of jealousy when your kid starts. Ive learned this dont justify any of it to anyone sit back and let your kid prove everyday that he belongs in the starting line up.

You're right. I know. It's not worth it and it doesn't matter anyway. What matters is what happens on the field. I'm getting better with time.

Why do parents act as they do.
That is the $64,000 question. I believe that the bottom line answer to this questions is LOVE. The love we feel for our children. The love a parent has for a child can only be understood by a parent.This love creates the strongest emotions we have within us. IMO their is no stronger feeling in the world than what a parent feels for a child. We provide for them, protect them, guide them and want nothing less than the best for them in every aspect of their lives. We want to see them succeed in their choosen path. I have listen to proud parents talk about there adult childrens business careers with the same joy as hearing a parent of a 12yo describe the walk off home run. Love and pride.

Now throw competition into that equation with another child trying to beat your child at something and our parental instincts kick in and all bets are off.
All of our parental instincts kick in and we go into overload and the emotions come out.

I am as guilty as anyone with struggling to control these less than desirable emotions. I think this is the basis of the over the top actions. The emotioins and feelings are there for all parents, just some of us handle it better than others.

IMO because these actions come from such a strong source they will always be a part of youth sports.

If it was love a parent would keep shut and not act up. My kid would be embarrased as I am sure most would.

I never worried about how others acted or what they said.

quote:

IMO their is no stronger feeling in the world than what a parent feels for a child.

I think you just nailed it.

quote:

Originally posted by Will:
I ask the question. do the kids have anything to do with the bad?

I think that if most kids are being "bad" it is fueled a lot by the parents.

It seems that parents do not realize or maybe just do not care that when they complain about a coach or a player to or where the kids hear it, it is very detrimental.

Example Parent tells Johnny they do not know why the Coach is not. You are the best player
on the team, that coach is an IDIOT!!! Then the kid
takes that to the field with him believing he is better than the other kids and the coach is an idiot.

Even if all of the above is true the kids do not need to be told this day in and day out.

I really thing if parents would stay out of it would not be so bad. But all it takes is ONE parent
going over the top and being negative it then just
dominos.

Brian Shanberg brought up the Bad News Bears as a movie example. How about Hoosiers. The Great Santini. Another example of sports parenting and the politics involved.

This stuff isn't new by any stretch of the imagination. I can remember fights during games when I was in HS. I know one of my friends' Dad got arrested during a basketball game that we were playing in. My Dad was a school administrator and I heard **** about politics all of the time. Politics. I had coaches that sucked up to me and coaches that made my life a living hades. I hated both.

All of these crazy parents and crazy coaches have been around for generations. They just get more press now and nobody wants to read about the good guys. They are boring.

quote:

The good, experienced teams resented having to allow weaker player/teams in the league.

That one struck me as being funny, there are always those coaches who load up their team with the studs, and of course they dominate, then the coach struts around thinking he is the best coach in the world.
I have always admired one of the coaches at our park, cause when other coaches find a reason not to take on a player that is not that good. He always takes that player and works with them, and some have turned out to be good players.

Fungo,
What a thought provoking topic!!!!
I have thought about this topic a LOT going back to days of T ball and a commitment I made that I would never coach little league.
Of course, as soon as our son was drafted as a 9 year old by the one coach known to be a terror, my course of action changed.
In that year, however, I learned a lot and it helped my thinking evolve.
From my view, baseball is the ultimate game of failure where the failure is individual and obvious to all. If my son strikes out, he knows it, I see it and everyone else does. Same if he makes an error. Our mistakes cannot be hidden by either the pace of the game or being hidden within the team, like in basketball/football/s****r.
Thus, when your son fails, he fails as an individual and "fails" on his teammates...at least that is the way it looks if you sit in the stands.
As parents, none of us want our children to "fail." We do everything we can do protect them from "failure" and all the negative connotations and rackets that "failure" communicates.
As parents, we "fail" to recognize that failure can be a positive and we fail to teach effectively that failure and mistakes are part of baseball.
I personally think we fail to communicate to players and parents alike how very difficult it is to play that darn game of baseball. We try and teach the physical part at the expense of never explaining or teaching the mental part.
Baseball is the game where it's pace does not provide for "immediate" gratification. When there is gratification, it is short lived until your next chance. Similarly, when you commit an error, you stand in alone in the field knowing your parents know, everyone else knows, and often times, as a parent, you hear others blaming your son, sometimes even the Coach is placing blame.
Superimposed on all of this is the concept that too many of us forget how hard it is to play baseball. Many of us forget that sometimes the other player played better. We are unwilling to accept that the reason our son failed is that someone else's son performed better that day.
Equally an issue is the fact that success can get overblown where we as parents live in the past of our son's performances rather than in the future where the focus truly belongs.
When I recognized that is was okay for our son to "fail" on a baseball field, it helped me understand it is just a "game." It also helped me recognize that maybe the opponent was better or better that day. Separating "failure" of being human from "failure" of playing in a game created a whole new world in which I could enjoy watching him play.
The joy was indeed in watching him play and compete, to succeed and fail, to have passion and love...for a game.

Wow, that is a great post.

infielddad - thank you thank you thank you. You just crystalized what has been a bad habit of mine. I resolve to follow your insights. I have become so caught up in performance (and lack of at times), that I have overlooked the true beauty of watching my son play a game. Some day he will stop playing and I can't put myself in a position where I look back and say I didn't enjoy it as much as I should have. I am going to force myself to change for the better going forward. Your words hit home like a brick.

.

Great post IFD...particularly this...

quote:

We try and teach the physical part at the expense of never explaining or teaching the mental part.

Wins, success, titles, stats are all fleeting...only life lessons remain: How to handle failure and success, How to take on challenege, The value of work ethic, How to be a team player...

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quote:

Wow, that is a great post.

DITTO!

The scary part is that some adults have to have this explained to them.

I am in agreement also, great post!
Funny thing, as son got older and the stakes got higher, there was actually LESS anxiety going on with us because we understood that the only person who could control what was going on was our player.

The only thing that ever drove me nuts was regarding health issues, other than that there wasn't much we could do but listen and given advice when asked.

.

quote:

Originally posted by TPM:
Funny thing, as son got older and the stakes got higher, there was actually LESS anxiety going on with us because we understood that the only person who could control what was going on was our player.

Would concur TPM...

In the last few years have had the opportunity to sit and watch the ball games of a score of MLB players sons...

Sitting in the stands wathcing ball games, taking with former MLB all stars and World Series winners watching their kids play was an enlightening experience. Both fathers and mothers, while obvioulsy caring, had far less anxiety/drama, or emotional reactions than the "normal" parents on the up or the down side. They were also a great deal more realistic and were not prone to tell everyone how great their kids were. IMO, knowing what they had seen of the top levels, to a person saw the thing as a small part of a long journey to be taken in stride, step by step. No big win's, no big losses, but simply always years of work to be done, levels to be climbed. Draft picks, recognition...while it was nice didn't really matter a whole bunch as the goal was simply to improve, move up, and get a shot at the next level.

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quote:

Originally posted by observer44:
.

quote:

Originally posted by TPM:
Funny thing, as son got older and the stakes got higher, there was actually LESS anxiety going on with us because we understood that the only person who could control what was going on was our player.

Would concur TPM...

In the last few years have had the opportunity to sit and watch the ball games of a score of MLB players sons...

Sitting in the stands wathcing ball games, taking with former MLB all stars and World Series winners watching their kids play was an enlightening experience. Both fathers and mothers, while obvioulsy caring, had far less anxiety/drama, or emotional reactions than the "normal" parents on the up or the down side. They were also a great deal more realistic and were not prone to tell everyone how great their kids were. IMO, knowing what they had seen of the top levels, to a person saw the thing as a small part of a long journey to be taken in stride, step by step. No big win's, no big losses, but simply always years of work to be done, levels to be climbed. Draft picks, recognition...while it was nice didn't really matter a whole bunch as the goal was simply to improve, move up, and get a shot at the next level.

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Wouldn't one conclude that achieving what was quoted above as one of the factors in behavior of parents in the process?

infielddad said..........."When I recognized that is was okay for our son to "fail" on a baseball field, it helped me understand it is just a "game"

Why do kids showcase?
Why do parents pay for showcases, premier travel baseball?

I doubt kid$(and parent$) travel long way$ to national competition$ just because its just another "game".

*****According to one source familiar with the dissension, Boras is believed to be asking that the Pirates pay another $200,000 in addition to the agreed upon $6 million. Doing so would ensure that Alvarez joined Buster Posey as the highest paid player in the Draft.

The Giants and Posey, the No. 5 overall selection, agreed to a $6.2 million bonus just moments before the midnight signing deadline. That signing bonus was the highest among the 2008 draft class, just slightly higher than the $6.15 million received by top pick Tim Beckham from Tampa Bay.*****

http://pittsburgh.pirates.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=...t&fext=.jsp&c_id=pit

OS8,
Not sure of the reason for the info on Alvarez, but if I was his mom I will admit I might be having a bit of anxiety.

Even if a kids going to get to the next level no anxiety from the parents is going to help that. The player has to want to get to the next level.My son got up at 5am all through the HS season to work out before school. he worked out with the coach. Anyone who wanted to could be there. The HS coach told me in 12 years he has had 2 players one being my son do this work out that was not a requirement. many parents later said the coach showed my son favortism > I told them ALL the boys were offered no one else wanted to do it. Then parents asked me what do you have to do to make your son want to get up before school and do that. I said what:Im still sleeping I never did a thing. point being no amount of anxiety, showcases, pressure will get your kid to the next level, only themselves.
If as one of the above post states its all about making big money at the draft> ok most of our kids will not get drafted. A very small percent. Does my son want to play pro ball? yes he does . Will he? who knows all I want is a four year degree four years from now. But he and most of our young men play and work hard becasue they have passion for the game and a inner drive that propels them to drive themselves hard to be the best player they can be. No parent can push that drive it is an internal love and passion that is God given in my opinion. The ones that have the natural talent and the drive will go far. sometimes the kids with the less talent are the ones most driven becasue they have been told for so long they wont play at the next level.It remains a game but as the game gets to the higher levels the work expected becomes more also.
For myself if baseball is over four years from now I will still have a son as many of you that I know can put in a hard day on the job becasue he knows how to work hard and go after what he wants.
But in all this the player has to have fun,he has to love what hes doing(NOT SAYING HE IS THRILLED AT THE 5AM WEIGHT LIFTING EVERY TIME. I think I remember myself not long ago stressing about where my son would land thougt things would turn out differenty then they did. But no amt of stress changed that. My son is on his own like alot of yours that are in college or as TPMs in the pros along with other posters. We helped them get where they are by supporting them and driving them to countless events,but never pressuring them and yelling at them, and never for me because I though he might sign for 4 millon dollars down the road. we did it because he loved and still loves the GAME of baseball.My hope is it always remains a game for him until the day he hangs the cleats up.

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quote:

Originally posted by OLDSLUGGER8: Wouldn't one conclude that achieving what was quoted above as one of the factors in behavior of parents in the process?

quote:

Originally posted by fanofgame:
Even if a kids going to get to the next level no anxiety from the parents is going to help that.

Exactly...that's what those who have been to the top know...in the end it ain't about me and my thrills and spills. It is a very long road, more marathon than AB to AB sprint, more trend than momentary peak and if it is going to happen it will be my son, and his talent and his passion that makes it happen.

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Great thread, Fungo. Thanks for starting it ... it has been a pleasure to see the differing views, tho I think most of them are of kindred spirit.

I stressed (still do a little) when he pitched (got worse the better he did because I didn't want HIM to be disappointed if his efforts failed) and very stressed when he batted. I almost hyperventilated during one game when he was throwing a 3 hit shut out going into the 9th inning in college .... I can still remember my breathing being so difficult ... and it was all because I love him to death and want him to be filled with joy out there, not because anything he does is a refletion on me.

Because you know how important it is to them. So you want them to succeed. If they could careless then the chances are pretty good you will not be sitting there on the edge.

There are ways to help your kid and then there are ways to hurt your kid. Most people figure it out over time. Some sooner than others. Some never do. Baseball is a game that when its going good you better not get too high. And when its going bad dont get too low. You can go from the penthouse to the outhouse very quickly. And you can go from the outhouse to the penthouse just as quickly.

I have always felt as long as my sons were giving everything they had to try and help their team win and they were working hard to continue to improve everything was all good.

The most important things you can teach your kids is baseball is not a sprint. It is a marathon. Just keep grinding away and have some fun along the way. And understand that you will fail. And as long as you have the courage to fail you will ultimately succeed.

I do not live and breathe my sons performance on the field. I enjoy watching him compete. I enjoy seeing him pour his heart into something that will teach him things that will last much longer than playing the game. Of course I want him to have success. But alot of what determines success in this game has nothing to do with your batting average or era.

If your good enough you will move on. If your not you wont. But sooner or later everyone will hang them up no matter how good you are. What you can take with you the rest of your life that you have learned from the game will be way more important than anything you do on the field.

I sit by myself because I do not want to talk during a baseball game. I want to watch all the things that most people will not notice. I want to watch all the kids not just mine. I want to enjoy the game because I know all to quickly it will be over. And I dont want to hear what most people have to say at a baseball game. It should be fun. It should be positive. And it is a game. The only time I would ever be upset with my son is if he did not hustle or made a bone head mistake because he was not focused. Other than that there is nothing to me more enjoyable than watching your kid do something they love to do. Alot of parents never get to do that.

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Coach May...

Great Post!

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OS8,
Not going to get into this xtra 200K. This unfortunetly is where the business of baseball gets ugly.
I do not disagree with some of what you say, but I can tell you that at this stage in my players career, all we want for him is to be happy and healthy. What ever happens is all up to him, not us. In college whatever he did was all about his team, as you go to the next level, team is not as important as your own personal development and again that is all up to him.

That was what I meant about the anxiety levels, it's his game, we learned that, that's the best advice I can give other than after each pitching outing or plate appearance, you wipe it out, 'cause tomorrow becomes a whole new day and a whole new game and there is nothing you can do to control the outcome.

The only ONE game I thought that I would really physically get sick was when he was called in unexpectedly to close out the last game of the super regional in 2005 and won. I never saw him cry so hard in his life over anything, and there wasn't one dry eye of anyone else wearing orange or purple in the stadium that day.

After that, everything else seemed like a piece of cake.

I finally learned after my son's sophomore year in HS to sit by myself out in right field up on the hill and smoke my wonderful cigar. All by myself!

There I can mutter and grumble all I want without anyone hearing me or making faces at me! LOL

quote:

Originally posted by YoungGunDad:
I finally learned after my son's sophomore year in HS to sit by myself out in right field up on the hill and smoke my wonderful cigar. All by myself!

There I can mutter and grumble all I want without anyone hearing me or making faces at me! LOL

LOL, Mr. TPM prefers the nearest tree!

Coach May,

funny becasue I am a mom, but I like to watch the game too. I never sit with the women, they all talk the whole time about everything besides baseball. I like to watch all the little things, all the moms always say why do you sit way out there, because I want to watch the game not talk about my nail appt or hair appt LOL.

Its really funny when we go to watch our son play. During the HS season it was easy because I was in the dugout and my wife sat with the other parents. But during the summer OMG! I tried believe me I tried. "Look , I got my nails done yesterday." "Is that Tommy pitching." "No honey thats Billy , Tommy plays centerfield." "Are you sure? It looks like Billy." "No honey Tommy is 5'10 Billy is 6'4." "Well he looks like Tommy." By this time I have missed two ab's and a diving catch. "What do you want to get to eat when the game is over?" "I dont care honey whatever you want to get is fine with me." Its the first inning. "Do you think there is a Subway near the field?" "I dont know but we can check it out after the game." "But we only have 1 hour between games." "OK I will get out my portable GPS and check for you." "See thats what I am talking about your are always such a smart a**!" "I am sorry honey. I will be right back I am going to stretch my legs." One hour and 30 minutes later I return its the 7th inning. "Why do you always disappear during the game?" "I ran into some friends and started talking and lost track of time." "Well you missed a good game." "No honey I was watching down the left field line." "Oh, did we win?"

Then its off to Subway!

quote:

Originally posted by Coach May:
Its really funny when we go to watch our son play. During the HS season it was easy because I was in the dugout and my wife sat with the other parents. But during the summer OMG! I tried believe me I tried. "Look , I got my nails done yesterday." "Is that Tommy pitching." "No honey thats Billy , Tommy plays centerfield." "Are you sure? It looks like Billy." "No honey Tommy is 5'10 Billy is 6'4." "Well he looks like Tommy." By this time I have missed two ab's and a diving catch. "What do you want to get to eat when the game is over?" "I dont care honey whatever you want to get is fine with me." Its the first inning. "Do you think there is a Subway near the field?" "I dont know but we can check it out after the game." "But we only have 1 hour between games." "OK I will get out my portable GPS and check for you." "See thats what I am talking about your are always such a smart a**!" "I am sorry honey. I will be right back I am going to stretch my legs." One hour and 30 minutes later I return its the 7th inning. "Why do you always disappear during the game?" "I ran into some friends and started talking and lost track of time." "Well you missed a good game." "No honey I was watching down the left field line." "Oh, did we win?"

Then its off to Subway!

Now that's funny!!!

However I suggest you might want to think about deleting your post before Misses Coach May sees it. That "big empty house" might get a little bit more empty if your not careful.

I'll bet he made that up!

I've only become upset a couple of times in I can't imagine how many games (three sports/two kids). Both were when my son was tackled and hurt going to the basket at the buzzer, along with no call because "you have to earn the last basket."

Otherwise, it's my kid's game regardless of which kid and which sport. If I'm coaching I have too many responsibilities than just my kids. If I'm watching, for them it's their game, for me it's entertainment. I've missed at bats from chatting with parents.

I know my kids will fail at times. It's why I don't get wrapped tight when fail. I know they will succeed more than they fail. I know there are certain positions (ex. pitcher) they play/played in various sports that provide more visibility. With visibility comes glory for winning and fault for losing. It's the risk/reward of stepping up.

I step in when my kids can't separate the game from the rest of the day. The only time I get on my kids is at home. I've asked them if they can reach their stated goals being a coach potato in a given week. Enjoy the ride.

I wonder if as our kids get older if we as adults don't grow up a little bit as well and realize that most of the “little league” stuff just doesn’t really matter.

I have to admit, I should probably be a little embarrassed about the things I used to get wrapped up in when my oldest son was 8,9 and 10 years old. Will he make the All Star team… I hope he gets on a good team… should he play on a travel team vs. town ball… Looking back, it seems kind of silly now. Did it really matter in the grand scheme of things? Probably not, as far as I know no one has signed a NLI or pro contract based on what they did when they were playing pre high school baseball. When I realized that and relaxed a bit, the game became more fun for me again because my perspective was back in focus. He was having fun and that was all that mattered. I think as I stopped stressing about such trivial stuff, my son probably did to. Thank god he loved the game as much as he did so he didn’t quit like so many other kids that say they are “burned out” at 13.

I am now going through it again with my youngest (13 year old) son and see things in a much different light. I watch some of the other parents living and dying with every pitch, I truly feel for them and wish I could tell them in the scope of things, it just doesn’t matter!!! I have to chuckle when I hear parents of boys that aren’t even playing on the big field yet mapping out their strategy of getting little Johnny to a level that he can play college ball or higher. Come on, the kid’s 12 year old! Let’s get him on the middle school team and out of braces before we have him shipped off to college!

Like Coach May stated, “If your good enough you will move on. If you’re not you won’t. But sooner or later everyone will hang them up no matter how good you are. What you can take with you the rest of your life that you have learned from the game will be way more important than anything you do on the field “. I don’t think anything sums it up any better than that.

Let your boys be boys, try to enjoy every minute while you still have them with you. Before you know it, when you look up they will have become a man on you. (Seemingly overnight)