I'm not bashing on PG. I just have a strange side obsession with public relations/marketing.
Gate fees and Stay to Play are just industry standards. I would have zero expectations that it would be anything different at a PG event
CaCO3Girl posted:PG lets 14 and under in free. I pay a gate fee in other events, and don't mind it at PG. I also know LP charges for parking and those that have been to LP can understand that it is a very cool place that likely needs to recoup some money to maintain and expand. So, I don't mind that either.
PG is NOT the only org that does this but can anyone explain the stay to play concept? I mean if a parent wants to stay in motel 8 or aunt Suzy's couch vs. the Authorized hotels, why does that matter?
To make sure there are enough rooms available for teams, you have to reserve blocks. Basically guaranteeing the hotel that "x" number of rooms will be booked. You could certainly do the leg work yourself and find a hotel with enough available rooms for an entire team, but it is going to be difficult if you are in a location with a big tournament and limited hotel space.
There is probably a financial incentive as well - but I would suspect the logistics behind making sure there are enough rooms available for a tourney with 100+ teams would eat away at that income pretty quickly.
For the most part when we have had stay to play, the hotel costs have been reasonably close to what we would have been able to book separately. Sometimes a few bucks more, but usually not more than that. What will get you is if you book late, and the lower rate hotels are all gone.
Ultimately, travel baseball is expensive - but nobody is forcing us to do it. It is like going into a Luis Vuitton store and complaining about the prices. Yes, the prices are high - but you don't have to shop there. If the costs involved with any tournament are out of line in your opinion - it's your right as a consumer to find a more affordable option.
PG and most other tournament organizations aren't non profit businesses. They have no obligation to provide their service as cheaply as possible. Actually, if they are hoping to stay in business - they should be looking to charge as much as the market will bear.
CaCO3Girl posted:PG lets 14 and under in free. I pay a gate fee in other events, and don't mind it at PG. I also know LP charges for parking and those that have been to LP can understand that it is a very cool place that likely needs to recoup some money to maintain and expand. So, I don't mind that either.
PG is NOT the only org that does this but can anyone explain the stay to play concept? I mean if a parent wants to stay in motel 8 or aunt Suzy's couch vs. the Authorized hotels, why does that matter?
It matters because these "authorized hotels" are giving a per room night commission to the organizations who are putting bodies into their hotels, therefore there is a quasi-requirement for the teams to ensure they book a certain number of room nights per team or face an additional registration cost (in some cases). The problem I have with gate fees is not just specific to PG or USA baseball. It's with a lot of tournaments in Cali as well. These kids aren't professionals and the people who are paying are usually parents
So the stay to play is so there are enough local rooms for all the teams? I guess that makes sense. I imagine any org would have an issue if the teams couldn't find rooms within 100 miles of the fields.
Stay to play benefits the tournament organization and no one else. They are getting a $10-15 commission on every room. If they were doing it as a service to the players/teams you would see large discounts passed onto the teams. Our organization books 75 rooms a weekend. It is optional to stay there and the rate has been 20-40% below the advertised rate and they always get us breakfast in that rate. That's the difference, one is doing it to help their families and the other is using the families as a profit center.
My apologies for this weather related post that morphed into gate and hotel policy discussion. This wasnt that bad, sure the games at 1AM were kinda crazy (we had two), but it could be talking points for our trip home...we got to play at LP three times so our team was one of the lucky ones...good competition as well. Team went 3-1 but ended up being behind two teams that were 3-0-1...crappy
PG didn't invent stay to play with commissions. It's the convention model. I doubt the commissions are making PG (the business) wealthy. It's part of the revenue stream to keep the business healthy. Without the hotel commissions the gate fees or team registration would be higher. One way or another you're going to pay. Without gate fees the team registrations would be higher.
Rob T postedTo make sure there are enough rooms available for teams, you have to reserve blocks. Basically guaranteeing the hotel that "x" number of rooms will be booked. You could certainly do the leg work yourself and find a hotel with enough available rooms for an entire team, but it is going to be difficult if you are in a location with a big tournament and limited hotel space.
There is probably a financial incentive as well - but I would suspect the logistics behind making sure there are enough rooms available for a tourney with 100+ teams would eat away at that income pretty quickly.
For the most part when we have had stay to play, the hotel costs have been reasonably close to what we would have been able to book separately. Sometimes a few bucks more, but usually not more than that. What will get you is if you book late, and the lower rate hotels are all gone.
Ultimately, travel baseball is expensive - but nobody is forcing us to do it. It is like going into a Luis Vuitton store and complaining about the prices. Yes, the prices are high - but you don't have to shop there. If the costs involved with any tournament are out of line in your opinion - it's your right as a consumer to find a more affordable option.
PG and most other tournament organizations aren't non profit businesses. They have no obligation to provide their service as cheaply as possible. Actually, if they are hoping to stay in business - they should be looking to charge as much as the market will bear.
Best advice of the day!
It's really pretty simple......play at the best tourney in the country at some of the best fields and easily the best baseball complex and pay a little extra.....or pay less and play against a bunch of no-name teams on crappy fields somewhere in Podunk, USA but save a little money on gate fees and hotels. It's your choice.....and the funny thing is, everyone knows up front when your team signs up to go to a PG or most any other top level tourney that there are gate fees and mandatory hotels. You team/organizations knows this BEFORE they send your check to PG or anyone else....so I just don't understand the complaining AFTER you get to the tourney
Buckeye!
Buckeye 2015 posted:It's really pretty simple......play at the best tourney in the country at some of the best fields and easily the best baseball complex and pay a little extra.....or pay less and play against a bunch of no-name teams on crappy fields somewhere in Podunk, USA but save a little money on gate fees and hotels. It's your choice.....and the funny thing is, everyone knows up front when your team signs up to go to a PG or most any other top level tourney that there are gate fees and mandatory hotels. You team/organizations knows this BEFORE they send your check to PG or anyone else....so I just don't understand the complaining AFTER you get to the tourney
Or stay in California and play against good teams on good fields in good weather. ;-)
That was tongue in cheek (obviously) but I agree with your "choice" point -- and teams in the Western third of the country by and large choose not to participate.
My 2018 had been looking toward his first PG event, a chance to go up against some great competition from across the country. He performed as well as he could, given the unusual circumstances.
He hit a couple bombs at HS fields in the middle of nowhere, met a fellow commit and future battery mate......... drummroll...... got to pitch at LP, velo was down a bit, complained about the mound and his footing as the turf kept moving around. He eventually done a front flip as the turf came unraveled, game was stopped until a repair was made. He sustained a bruised knee and a pulled muscle in the tumble.
Pitching at LP only solidified his decision in committing to a program that has dirt/grass......he hates playing on turf!
My intention is not to pile on, but one's perspective and where they come from can be the difference in what is perceived normal or extreme circumstances. The WWBA is a memory now....................good, bad, indifferent, he's already looking toward his next opportunity to play the game.
Backpick25 posted:My 2018 had been looking toward his first PG event, a chance to go up against some great competition from across the country. He performed as well as he could, given the unusual circumstances.
He hit a couple bombs at HS fields in the middle of nowhere, met a fellow commit and future battery mate......... drummroll...... got to pitch at LP, velo was down a bit, complained about the mound and his footing as the turf kept moving around. He eventually done a front flip as the turf came unraveled, game was stopped until a repair was made. He sustained a bruised knee and a pulled muscle in the tumble.
Pitching at LP only solidified his decision in committing to a program that has dirt/grass......he hates playing on turf!
My intention is not to pile on, but one's perspective and where they come from can be the difference in what is perceived normal or extreme circumstances. The WWBA is a memory now....................good, bad, indifferent, he's already looking toward his next opportunity to play the game.
We were just there for the 14U WWBA last week. The turf mounds were awful. There was a 3" hole right in the center of the rubber where if you are a RH pitcher & you throw from 3B side of rubber, your heel would literally be 3" below your toe. You cant fill it in or adjust it as all you have are the little rubber pellets & they don't pack. Everyone must then throw from the middle of the rubber. In addition, the landing spot is one common area with a large indentation. If your stride does not fit here, hang with em because you cant dig one out or repack a spot. so you land with an awkward plant on uneven ground if your stride is not common. In short, it was a disaster, unsafe, unprofessional & extremely disappointing given the $$ spent to play there. Add some moisture & it is gas on the fire. Some of our guys seemed to be OK dealing with it & several really struggled & were simply not themselves.
Steve A. posted:Backpick25 posted:My 2018 had been looking toward his first PG event, a chance to go up against some great competition from across the country. He performed as well as he could, given the unusual circumstances.
He hit a couple bombs at HS fields in the middle of nowhere, met a fellow commit and future battery mate......... drummroll...... got to pitch at LP, velo was down a bit, complained about the mound and his footing as the turf kept moving around. He eventually done a front flip as the turf came unraveled, game was stopped until a repair was made. He sustained a bruised knee and a pulled muscle in the tumble.
Pitching at LP only solidified his decision in committing to a program that has dirt/grass......he hates playing on turf!
My intention is not to pile on, but one's perspective and where they come from can be the difference in what is perceived normal or extreme circumstances. The WWBA is a memory now....................good, bad, indifferent, he's already looking toward his next opportunity to play the game.
We were just there for the 14U WWBA last week. The turf mounds were awful. There was a 3" hole right in the center of the rubber where if you are a RH pitcher & you throw from 3B side of rubber, your heel would literally be 3" below your toe. You cant fill it in or adjust it as all you have are the little rubber pellets & they don't pack. Everyone must then throw from the middle of the rubber. In addition, the landing spot is one common area with a large indentation. If your stride does not fit here, hang with em because you cant dig one out or repack a spot. so you land with an awkward plant on uneven ground if your stride is not common. In short, it was a disaster, unsafe, unprofessional & extremely disappointing given the $$ spent to play there. Add some moisture & it is gas on the fire. Some of our guys seemed to be OK dealing with it & several really struggled & were simply not themselves.
Wow, that sounds bad & some emergency repairs are needed.
Steve A. posted:Backpick25 posted:My 2018 had been looking toward his first PG event, a chance to go up against some great competition from across the country. He performed as well as he could, given the unusual circumstances.
He hit a couple bombs at HS fields in the middle of nowhere, met a fellow commit and future battery mate......... drummroll...... got to pitch at LP, velo was down a bit, complained about the mound and his footing as the turf kept moving around. He eventually done a front flip as the turf came unraveled, game was stopped until a repair was made. He sustained a bruised knee and a pulled muscle in the tumble.
Pitching at LP only solidified his decision in committing to a program that has dirt/grass......he hates playing on turf!
My intention is not to pile on, but one's perspective and where they come from can be the difference in what is perceived normal or extreme circumstances. The WWBA is a memory now....................good, bad, indifferent, he's already looking toward his next opportunity to play the game.
We were just there for the 14U WWBA last week. The turf mounds were awful. There was a 3" hole right in the center of the rubber where if you are a RH pitcher & you throw from 3B side of rubber, your heel would literally be 3" below your toe. You cant fill it in or adjust it as all you have are the little rubber pellets & they don't pack. Everyone must then throw from the middle of the rubber. In addition, the landing spot is one common area with a large indentation. If your stride does not fit here, hang with em because you cant dig one out or repack a spot. so you land with an awkward plant on uneven ground if your stride is not common. In short, it was a disaster, unsafe, unprofessional & extremely disappointing given the $$ spent to play there. Add some moisture & it is gas on the fire. Some of our guys seemed to be OK dealing with it & several really struggled & were simply not themselves.
He is a RHP that throws from the 3rd base side of the rubber. As a 17yr old, he used other words to describe it. Yes, add in moisture he was sliding. He was 90-92 two weeks before and with adaptation for conditions and a poorly maintained mound, 88. He was disappointed that he really couldn't show his stuff............not that anyone was around at 1am.
2019Dad posted:Steve A. posted:Backpick25 posted:My 2018 had been looking toward his first PG event, a chance to go up against some great competition from across the country. He performed as well as he could, given the unusual circumstances.
He hit a couple bombs at HS fields in the middle of nowhere, met a fellow commit and future battery mate......... drummroll...... got to pitch at LP, velo was down a bit, complained about the mound and his footing as the turf kept moving around. He eventually done a front flip as the turf came unraveled, game was stopped until a repair was made. He sustained a bruised knee and a pulled muscle in the tumble.
Pitching at LP only solidified his decision in committing to a program that has dirt/grass......he hates playing on turf!
My intention is not to pile on, but one's perspective and where they come from can be the difference in what is perceived normal or extreme circumstances. The WWBA is a memory now....................good, bad, indifferent, he's already looking toward his next opportunity to play the game.
We were just there for the 14U WWBA last week. The turf mounds were awful. There was a 3" hole right in the center of the rubber where if you are a RH pitcher & you throw from 3B side of rubber, your heel would literally be 3" below your toe. You cant fill it in or adjust it as all you have are the little rubber pellets & they don't pack. Everyone must then throw from the middle of the rubber. In addition, the landing spot is one common area with a large indentation. If your stride does not fit here, hang with em because you cant dig one out or repack a spot. so you land with an awkward plant on uneven ground if your stride is not common. In short, it was a disaster, unsafe, unprofessional & extremely disappointing given the $$ spent to play there. Add some moisture & it is gas on the fire. Some of our guys seemed to be OK dealing with it & several really struggled & were simply not themselves.
Wow, that sounds bad & some emergency repairs are needed.
On day 5 they finally cut out about a 6 X 8 section of carpet including the whole area & replaced. This was then decent but with most all using molded cleats, it quickly degenerates into ruts at the rubber & landing. I asked the grounds guys how long it takes them to replace the section & they told me about 2 Hrs or so. My opinion is they should go with real dirt mounds & let the rest roll. You will have to pack them in between games but they still are out there sweeping the dipping dot rubber pellets into the ruts anyway so no harm & a vastly better surface to compete on. Not even a debate really.
Backpick25 posted:Steve A. posted:Backpick25 posted:My 2018 had been looking toward his first PG event, a chance to go up against some great competition from across the country. He performed as well as he could, given the unusual circumstances.
He hit a couple bombs at HS fields in the middle of nowhere, met a fellow commit and future battery mate......... drummroll...... got to pitch at LP, velo was down a bit, complained about the mound and his footing as the turf kept moving around. He eventually done a front flip as the turf came unraveled, game was stopped until a repair was made. He sustained a bruised knee and a pulled muscle in the tumble.
Pitching at LP only solidified his decision in committing to a program that has dirt/grass......he hates playing on turf!
My intention is not to pile on, but one's perspective and where they come from can be the difference in what is perceived normal or extreme circumstances. The WWBA is a memory now....................good, bad, indifferent, he's already looking toward his next opportunity to play the game.
We were just there for the 14U WWBA last week. The turf mounds were awful. There was a 3" hole right in the center of the rubber where if you are a RH pitcher & you throw from 3B side of rubber, your heel would literally be 3" below your toe. You cant fill it in or adjust it as all you have are the little rubber pellets & they don't pack. Everyone must then throw from the middle of the rubber. In addition, the landing spot is one common area with a large indentation. If your stride does not fit here, hang with em because you cant dig one out or repack a spot. so you land with an awkward plant on uneven ground if your stride is not common. In short, it was a disaster, unsafe, unprofessional & extremely disappointing given the $$ spent to play there. Add some moisture & it is gas on the fire. Some of our guys seemed to be OK dealing with it & several really struggled & were simply not themselves.
He is a RHP that throws from the 3rd base side of the rubber. As a 17yr old, he used other words to describe it. Yes, add in moisture he was sliding. He was 90-92 two weeks before and with adaptation for conditions and a poorly maintained mound, 88. He was disappointed that he really couldn't show his stuff............not that anyone was around at 1am.
Identical experience here, my friend. Identical with several of ours & I am sure we are not alone.
Steve A. posted:2019Dad posted:Steve A. posted:Backpick25 posted:My 2018 had been looking toward his first PG event, a chance to go up against some great competition from across the country. He performed as well as he could, given the unusual circumstances.
He hit a couple bombs at HS fields in the middle of nowhere, met a fellow commit and future battery mate......... drummroll...... got to pitch at LP, velo was down a bit, complained about the mound and his footing as the turf kept moving around. He eventually done a front flip as the turf came unraveled, game was stopped until a repair was made. He sustained a bruised knee and a pulled muscle in the tumble.
Pitching at LP only solidified his decision in committing to a program that has dirt/grass......he hates playing on turf!
My intention is not to pile on, but one's perspective and where they come from can be the difference in what is perceived normal or extreme circumstances. The WWBA is a memory now....................good, bad, indifferent, he's already looking toward his next opportunity to play the game.
We were just there for the 14U WWBA last week. The turf mounds were awful. There was a 3" hole right in the center of the rubber where if you are a RH pitcher & you throw from 3B side of rubber, your heel would literally be 3" below your toe. You cant fill it in or adjust it as all you have are the little rubber pellets & they don't pack. Everyone must then throw from the middle of the rubber. In addition, the landing spot is one common area with a large indentation. If your stride does not fit here, hang with em because you cant dig one out or repack a spot. so you land with an awkward plant on uneven ground if your stride is not common. In short, it was a disaster, unsafe, unprofessional & extremely disappointing given the $$ spent to play there. Add some moisture & it is gas on the fire. Some of our guys seemed to be OK dealing with it & several really struggled & were simply not themselves.
Wow, that sounds bad & some emergency repairs are needed.
On day 5 they finally cut out about a 6 X 8 section of carpet including the whole area & replaced. This was then decent but with most all using molded cleats, it quickly degenerates into ruts at the rubber & landing. I asked the grounds guys how long it takes them to replace the section & they told me about 2 Hrs or so. My opinion is they should go with real dirt mounds & let the rest roll. You will have to pack them in between games but they still are out there sweeping the dipping dot rubber pellets into the ruts anyway so no harm & a vastly better surface to compete on. Not even a debate really.
I just have this idea by me in Chicagoland. 4 fields. Turf with real monds, and maybe real batters boxes. The turf is so we can play afeter rain. Too many fields are done for the day after a light rain. I think you would pack the place between early high school games and all summer.
Let me add that everything else about the experience was top notch. The facility is incredible, the umpires were great, the scoring & velo displays on the scoreboard & everyone we met was solid. They had to juggle the schedule due to rain & it was very well handled. The mounds were just not remotely good & frankly unsafe.
Obviously the intent is to be able to handle rain & play almost immediately, which works. I like golfmans idea though but PG runs a business & they have obviously looked at it & decided otherwise.
Steve A. posted:Let me add that everything else about the experience was top notch. The facility is incredible, the umpires were great, the scoring & velo displays on the scoreboard & everyone we met was solid. They had to juggle the schedule due to rain & it was very well handled. The mounds were just not remotely good & frankly unsafe.
Obviously the intent is to be able to handle rain & play almost immediately, which works. I like golfmans idea though but PG runs a business & they have obviously looked at it & decided otherwise.
I don't know. A professional dirt mound has to be better that what we are hearing. You may have to re-clay it a few times per season, but turf requires maintenance too.
Golfman25 posted:Steve A. posted:Let me add that everything else about the experience was top notch. The facility is incredible, the umpires were great, the scoring & velo displays on the scoreboard & everyone we met was solid. They had to juggle the schedule due to rain & it was very well handled. The mounds were just not remotely good & frankly unsafe.
Obviously the intent is to be able to handle rain & play almost immediately, which works. I like golfmans idea though but PG runs a business & they have obviously looked at it & decided otherwise.
I don't know. A professional dirt mound has to be better that what we are hearing. You may have to re-clay it a few times per season, but turf requires maintenance too.
My thoughts as well. Turf has a life cycle. A local High school football field had a warranty issue in year 3....full replacement. My guess is, warranty on a place like LP does not exist as it is not normal wear due to the thousands of games played on that surface every season.
Pretty cool place when the surface conditions are new but deferred maintenance will lead to issues. I had seen a kid get tore to ribbons sliding into 3rd last year (at another facility) due to poor turf maintenance, when a bad repaired edge rolled up and the backing skrim layed him open! BTW,Love the dirt mound/bb idea!
Golf- I've often wondered why Chicagoland never had an event like WWBA. The largest hockey tournament in North America is held there every fall! If they've got enough rinks to accommodate a tourney of that size, they have the fields!
Golf- I've often wondered why Chicagoland never had an event like WWBA. The largest hockey tournament in North America is held there every fall! If they've got enough rinks to accommodate a tourney of that size, they have the fields!
Have you seen the status of Illinois' budget lately?
Teaching Elder posted:Golf- I've often wondered why Chicagoland never had an event like WWBA. The largest hockey tournament in North America is held there every fall! If they've got enough rinks to accommodate a tourney of that size, they have the fields!
Have you seen the status of Illinois' budget lately?
Well, there's that...
Batty67 posted:Teaching Elder posted:Golf- I've often wondered why Chicagoland never had an event like WWBA. The largest hockey tournament in North America is held there every fall! If they've got enough rinks to accommodate a tourney of that size, they have the fields!
Have you seen the status of Illinois' budget lately?
Well, there's that...
Lol, yep...........the tolls in the 355/80 corridor would likely get the gate fee/parking lot sensitive going as well!
Years ago, myself and a close associate attempted to partner up with the Field of Dreams owner. She was based out of Chicago and loved our proposal to put in a baseball complex, making the home and original field the center piece of the development. The town of Dyersville rejected it and we all moved on! What a cool setting that woulda been!
I was simply nodding approval to a regional effort that would likely pull the Ohio Valley to the East and a lot from the upper Midwest........13 hours to Atlanta, I had no idea it rained everyday!!...............I get it, a majority of baseball schools are in that region.
It's usually not like this. Most summers are hot and parched. For some reason the whole south east is under water this year. Last fall it didn't rain for like 60 or 70 days straight.
There's this old saying, "When it rains it..." You finish it.
Last year 16u was blisteringly hot and dry, dry, dry.
I don't get the mound issue. We had a thread here awhile back where PG Staff said he didn't want people pitching on mounds that had issues. He said to tell the ump and then the field person. Was it that no one wanted to complain for fear of their game being cancelled?
The jet stream coming up from the gulf pulls up moisture to the southeast, I do believe. Atlanta is not dry in summer.
Alabama has been a swamp this year. Several high school games and county tourney rained out. Torrential down pours everyday. SE GA, were I am now. Rain, rain, rain. At least it makes things cooler.
South Florida almost floated away in May. We hadnt had rain and the state was burning up, then WHAM.
I remember one year at Jupiter WWBA they had to bring in helicopters to dry the fields. That was in October. The first year that my son played, when WWBA was in its infancy, it rained all day.
Jeez people, rain and baseball go hand in hand. Do you all think that it will ever be any different?
Get over it already.
CaCO3Girl posted:I don't get the mound issue. We had a thread here awhile back where PG Staff said he didn't want people pitching on mounds that had issues. He said to tell the ump and then the field person. Was it that no one wanted to complain for fear of their game being cancelled?
The point is that there is no immediate solution to the issue. You have a turf surface with a large rut at the rubber & landing. All the field crew can do is sweep little rubber pebbles into the rut which you can not pack so it is like pitching in sand.
Steve A. posted:CaCO3Girl posted:I don't get the mound issue. We had a thread here awhile back where PG Staff said he didn't want people pitching on mounds that had issues. He said to tell the ump and then the field person. Was it that no one wanted to complain for fear of their game being cancelled?
The point is that there is no immediate solution to the issue. You have a turf surface with a large rut at the rubber & landing. All the field crew can do is sweep little rubber pebbles into the rut which you can not pack so it is like pitching in sand.
There was also a hole in the turf with bare concrete showing (landing). Son was told to move over by the umpire...... The umpire stopped the game after he took the tumble and made them repair it.
Its a facility issue. I would think, IF the facility likes holding the prestigious events, they would perform maintenance as needed. I'm pretty sure I could find a qualified inspector with a simple phone call, starting with the original vendor that installed the turf.
The problem areas are excessive wear areas. By the numbers, the fields likely take on many times the wear it takes a similar complex that supports local events only.
Backpick25 posted:Steve A. posted:CaCO3Girl posted:I don't get the mound issue. We had a thread here awhile back where PG Staff said he didn't want people pitching on mounds that had issues. He said to tell the ump and then the field person. Was it that no one wanted to complain for fear of their game being cancelled?
The point is that there is no immediate solution to the issue. You have a turf surface with a large rut at the rubber & landing. All the field crew can do is sweep little rubber pebbles into the rut which you can not pack so it is like pitching in sand.
There was also a hole in the turf with bare concrete showing (landing). Son was told to move over by the umpire...... The umpire stopped the game after he took the tumble and made them repair it.
Its a facility issue. I would think, IF the facility likes holding the prestigious events, they would perform maintenance as needed. I'm pretty sure I could find a qualified inspector with a simple phone call, starting with the original vendor that installed the turf.
The problem areas are excessive wear areas. By the numbers, the fields likely take on many times the wear it takes a similar complex that supports local events only.
Dirt mound-Problem Solved- Rake, water, tamper, done in 5 minutes.
Steve A. posted:Backpick25 posted:Steve A. posted:CaCO3Girl posted:I don't get the mound issue. We had a thread here awhile back where PG Staff said he didn't want people pitching on mounds that had issues. He said to tell the ump and then the field person. Was it that no one wanted to complain for fear of their game being cancelled?
The point is that there is no immediate solution to the issue. You have a turf surface with a large rut at the rubber & landing. All the field crew can do is sweep little rubber pebbles into the rut which you can not pack so it is like pitching in sand.
There was also a hole in the turf with bare concrete showing (landing). Son was told to move over by the umpire...... The umpire stopped the game after he took the tumble and made them repair it.
Its a facility issue. I would think, IF the facility likes holding the prestigious events, they would perform maintenance as needed. I'm pretty sure I could find a qualified inspector with a simple phone call, starting with the original vendor that installed the turf.
The problem areas are excessive wear areas. By the numbers, the fields likely take on many times the wear it takes a similar complex that supports local events only.
Dirt mound-Problem Solved- Rake, water, tamper, done in 5 minutes.
As CaCo3Girl stated, we discussed this earlier (spring) and PG stated that LakePoint was in charge of the grounds but he seemed surprised that there was an issue. I am surprised this is not a top priority with LP/PG and that it is not on the top of every tournament checklist. To restate the obvious, with the amount of money being put into these tournaments, this should not be an issue. From a pitcher's perspective, if you are worrying about your landing, you are not being effective.
I think I will call a couple weeks in advance the next time we play LP.
No doubt that there are times when the turf needs to be repaired. It appears that many here on the HSBBW have had a bad experience, which seems odd. When I hear about pitchers that have lost velocity because of the conditions I have to wonder how we end up with the following numbers from those same LP mounds. Most of these pitchers we have seen before on dirt mounds and they were at or above their previous peak velocity.
Anyway, I prefer dirt/clay mounds also. That was my recommendation at the start. The original plans called for 16 fields, but colleges with all turf fields told us we would be crazy to put dirt mounds in. Dirt mounds can deteriate quickly when this many games are played each day., The turf mounds stay exactly the same all the time unless they need to be repaired. They are actually more consistent. The other problem is they leak into the turf creating a somewhat ugly appearance that can only be improved at the end of the day.
That said, just like many of you, I still prefer dirt mounds. But everyone prefers playing at LP rather than the other fields with dirt mounds. I know we have told people if they prefer we can schedule all their games away from LP and the all turf fields. We actually had one team do that a couple years ago.
Regarding colleges... hasn't anyone noticed the large number of colleges switching to all turf fields? If the trend continues it will be hard to avoid them at the major college division.
My advise... pitchers should tell umpires while they are warming up if there is any problem with the mound. If something happens to the mound during live play they should immediately inform the umpire. None of our umpires will allow a pitcher to throw on an unsafe mound. We do not want any pitchers to throw on an unsafe mound. Mounds are checked after every game and if they cant be fixed immediately they are repaired over night for the next days play.
Once again, if anyone has a concern or complaint about anything please contact staff@perfectgame.org
I am the only PG person that is involved here at the HSBBW. I try to respond as much as possible, but to be honest it seems like a bit much sometimes.
Kumar Rocker | 98 |
| Ethan Hankins | 97 |
| Mason Denaburg | 97 |
| Slade Cecconi | 96 |
| JT Ginn | 95 |
| Alberto Gonzalez | 95 |
| Tyler Ras | 94 |
| Austin Becker | 94 |
| Bo Blessie | 94 |
| Brandon Birdsell | 94 |
| Luke Bartnicki | 94 |
| Matt Rudis | 94 |
| Joseph Menefee | 94 |
| Ryan Cusick | 94 |
| Ethan Smith | 94 |
| Joseph Charles | 93 |
| Kolby Kubichek | 93 |
| Brandon Neeck | 93 |
| Stephen Pelli | 93 |
| Cooper Stinson | 93 |
| Patrick Halligan | 93 |
| Brandon Smith | 93 |
| Wade Beasley | 93 |
| Marcelo Perez | 93 |
| Carter Raffield | 93 |
| Simeon Woods-Richardson | 93 |
| Justin Jarvis | 93 |
| Mitchel Megias | 92 |
| Aj Stinson | 92 |
| Cort Roedig | 92 |
| Blake Dockery | 92 |
| Mason Pelio | 92 |
| Benjamin Specht | 92 |
| Jonathan Childress | 92 |
| Hunter Barco | 92 |
| Jonathan Jones | 92 |
| Gunnar Hoglund | 92 |
| Matt Rudis | 92 |
| Anderson Needham | 92 |
PGStaff posted:No doubt that there are times when the turf needs to be repaired. It appears that many here on the HSBBW have had a bad experience, which seems odd. When I hear about pitchers that have lost velocity because of the conditions I have to wonder how we end up with the following numbers from those same LP mounds. Most of these pitchers we have seen before on dirt mounds and they were at or above their previous peak velocity.
Anyway, I prefer dirt/clay mounds also. That was my recommendation at the start. The original plans called for 16 fields, but colleges with all turf fields told us we would be crazy to put dirt mounds in. Dirt mounds can deteriate quickly when this many games are played each day., The turf mounds stay exactly the same all the time unless they need to be repaired. They are actually more consistent. The other problem is they leak into the turf creating a somewhat ugly appearance that can only be improved at the end of the day.
That said, just like many of you, I still prefer dirt mounds. But everyone prefers playing at LP rather than the other fields with dirt mounds. I know we have told people if they prefer we can schedule all their games away from LP and the all turf fields. We actually had one team do that a couple years ago.
Regarding colleges... hasn't anyone noticed the large number of colleges switching to all turf fields? If the trend continues it will be hard to avoid them at the major college division.
My advise... pitchers should tell umpires while they are warming up if there is any problem with the mound. If something happens to the mound during live play they should immediately inform the umpire. None of our umpires will allow a pitcher to throw on an unsafe mound. We do not want any pitchers to throw on an unsafe mound. Mounds are checked after every game and if they cant be fixed immediately they are repaired over night for the next days play.
Once again, if anyone has a concern or complaint about anything please contact staff@perfectgame.org
I am the only PG person that is involved here at the HSBBW. I try to respond as much as possible, but to be honest it seems like a bit much sometimes.
Kumar Rocker
98 Ethan Hankins 97 Mason Denaburg 97 Slade Cecconi 96 JT Ginn 95 Alberto Gonzalez 95 Tyler Ras 94 Austin Becker 94 Bo Blessie 94 Brandon Birdsell 94 Luke Bartnicki 94 Matt Rudis 94 Joseph Menefee 94 Ryan Cusick 94 Ethan Smith 94 Joseph Charles 93 Kolby Kubichek 93 Brandon Neeck 93 Stephen Pelli 93 Cooper Stinson 93 Patrick Halligan 93 Brandon Smith 93 Wade Beasley 93 Marcelo Perez 93 Carter Raffield 93 Simeon Woods-Richardson 93 Justin Jarvis 93 Mitchel Megias 92 Aj Stinson 92 Cort Roedig 92 Blake Dockery 92 Mason Pelio 92 Benjamin Specht 92 Jonathan Childress 92 Hunter Barco 92 Jonathan Jones 92 Gunnar Hoglund 92 Matt Rudis 92 Anderson Needham 92
Thanks for the reply & clarifying. There is no easy answer & I basically told our guys to suck it up & deal with it as others were clearly not having an issue (as you illustrate above). But for those that did have an issue, in short, the experience was not good & did not reflect their ability. We did report the issue to the grounds crew & some guy came out with a broom & swept little rubber pellets into a 3" divot which was basically useless as would be expected after about 4 warm ups they were out of the hole & you were down to the concrete base again.
I was not even aware that others had an issue & would not have even mentioned it until I saw these posts so clearly it is not good but there are mound issues wherever you go & you have to find a way. That's the bottom line.
Imagine you had the same issue in the batters box & every player had to have the same stance. There would be wailing & gnashing of teeth. Some guys are wide, some narrow, some front, some back, some no stride, short, long. Now make them all stand the same spread & stride the same & you would have major issues. This is what these mounds are like when they get run down. You have 2 options. Pitch from the hole & land in the common hole, or extend about 4" off the side of the rubber & land & push from solid ground. we tried option #2 & the second batter took 1 in the ear hole about 82 Right on right from a kid who generally has great command.
PS: I'm the guy you see out after the game with the rake packing the mound back as nobody else seems to care so I am clearly biased here.
In addition. For College purposes when you play 1 game a day they can easily retread the entire mound between games & you would be fine. They are not understanding that you are playing about 8 games on these daily X 4-5 days before you cut out & retread so its no comparison.
If they charge it...baseball parents will pay it. Its what we do
In the last 60 games all played at LP there were over 80 pitchers that threw 90 or better, up to 98.
We actually do have colleges play there in the spring, many games a day. Occasionally we do have to make repairs. I would prefer dirt mounds, but we don't have them at LP. I would also prefer dirt batters box, but we don't have that either. Even though we have to repair the mounds once in a great while I'm amazed by the fact their are the number of people here on this site that have had a problem. We get a lot of complaints about a lot of different things. I honestly can only remember a very few over the past three years complain about the mounds. The pitchers we know and talk to that are among the best in the country just never seem to complain and pretty much always throw very well from those same exact mounds. Every night the faulty mounds are repaired with new turf. We have shut down fields that have faulty mounds. There is no reason for a pitcher to pitch on a mound that is in bad shape. And we get so few complaints about the mounds. Those that we do get are almost always justified.
Just seems strange that so many here at HSBBW have had bad experiences. Most people that complain simply contact us. I get that some of these are genuine concerns, but people don't know that we have enemies/competitors on this site that jump on PG every chance they get. They love these topics.
I really don't know what to say. LP has all turf fields, when it rains they come in very handy. We have had power DI colleges experience bad weather elsewhere and play their games at LP. That is the major reason for the turf and it is very expensive. People can argue all they want, it isn't likely to change anything. If someone doesn't want to play there, they simply have tell us. There are a lot of nice fields in Atlanta. Or everyone has the right to stay away. Anyone that thinks a great dirt/clay mound is best... I agree with you. If you think any dirt mound is better, I have to disagree.