@RJM posted:If the 2025 proceeds to develop both he and the college win. If the 2025 doesn’t proceed to develop fall of senior year at NLI signing time the coach will say to the 2025, “Here at Northwest Baseball State we keep our word. We will honor our offer. But, I don’t see you ever getting on the field for us.”
Funny enough Northwest Baseball State reached out to my son just yesterday. Small world RJM... crazy when you think about it.
The first 2021 commitment (a position player) in our state committed to an SEC program before he had played an inning of high school ball. About halfway through high school the HC at the SEC program was canned. Offer wasn't rescinded but the program essentially ghosted him over his junior and senior years. Decommitted late and is now at a solid, but lower profile Juco and not likely to see the field as a freshman. I wish the best for the kid, but all the awe and reverence his super early commitment created for him is now a distant memory and of zero help to him. I can't fault anyone for committing early like that though. Had an SEC program offered my kid prior to stepping foot on a HS field? I can't imagine the fortitude needed to resist grabbing it immediately. The number of players and parents smart and strong enough to actually resist those set of circumstances is incredibly small. If you're one of them, you are truly special and incredibly different than 99%+ of your peers.
@IAmThatGuy posted:Funny enough Northwest Baseball State reached out to my son just yesterday. Small world RJM... crazy when you think about it.
Wait! I thought YOU told THEM your son was coming to Northwest B.S. and to clear out a locker for him.
I saw their tweet: "Blessed to announce that our new leadoff hitter and weekend starter, IAMTHATGUY'SSON, chose us over Vanderbilt and Mississippi State"
@smokeminside posted:Wait! I thought YOU told THEM your son was coming to Northwest B.S. and to clear out a locker for him.
I saw their tweet: "Blessed to announce that our new leadoff hitter and weekend starter, IAMTHATGUY'SSON, chose us over Vanderbilt and Mississippi State"
We chose Clemson, but for some reason, they are ghosting us right now. I think TPM might have said something to them. We are opening it all back up and have no interest in the ACC now due to our experience. So we will focus instead on the top end of the SEC.
As you should.
@RJM posted:If the 2025 proceeds to develop both he and the college win. If the 2025 doesn’t proceed to develop fall of senior year at NLI signing time the coach will say to the 2025, “Here at Northwest Baseball State we keep our word. We will honor our offer. But, I don’t see you ever getting on the field for us.”
What do you think happens then? Who has everything to win and nothing to lose with a very early commit? If a 2025 is in demand now imagine how in demand he will be in a year or two assuming he continues to develop. The only reason to commit this early is if the kid is physically developed, has more physical development in the tank (he’s a top prospect) and it’s his dream school.
Girls physically develop sooner. My daughter had offers flooding in the summer after freshman year. Fortunately she knew what she wanted for a major. At that age most kids don’t know what they want for lunch. Still, she never spent a day working in the field of her major.
On the same page. Five years out from college is an eternity. So many things could change, but I’m guessing all the top schools were offering. Probably dream school. Pretty sure he’s a reclass and looks the part. Kid has been hitting the ball a long way for a long time. If he continues to progress at the current pace I doubt school is even in the picture anyway.
You guys are getting incredibly good at talking me down. My son will continue to go to the smaller showcases for the experience more than anything. It’s not a horrible way to spend a day and a few dollars.
Thanks again.
I’m understanding the size matters issue more than ever. The multi-school showcase he attended was a mess. What was supposed to be a 4 hour metrics session turned out to be a 6 1/2 hour waste of time. Many of the “scouts” left after the first session. The only two metrics that my son received were pop time and exit velo. He did get a bonus metric for infield velo which was nice. The only problem was that he didn’t throw across the infield. Catcher pop times were measured 4 1/2 hours in after the six catchers had caught about 75 bull pins and cooled off and warmed back up four times. By the time they got around to pop times, the catchers were so gassed that most of them were one hopping to second and only one player from the two sessions broke the 2.0 mark. My son typically doesn’t have a problem braking 2.0, but posted a 2.13. Several of the catchers he trains with also posted much higher than normal times. All in all not very productive, but at least we learned where not to go heading into the all important Junior year summer. I get more than ever why there is such a reliance on size in the scouting process when the metrics aren’t really reliable.
Very much a live and learn experience. My son is also going to need a lot more help from his travel organization and trainers than I originally thought and had hoped for. Back in his pitching days, his pitching coach said something that has stuck with me. “It’s not just about being good. Everyone is good at the next level. It’s also about being lucky.” So in addition to to the long hours of training and practice, we’ll be mixing in some finger crossing 🤣.
Thanks again to all of you that have shared your experiences. Much of the advice is proving to be accurate and helpful.
nick "I’m understanding the size matters issue more than ever."
You don't know how right you are!
My guy is an absolute weight room and metric monster,...and is still a little amazed at the size of the older D1's.
Get your head down and work like a dog!!
Unfortunately there is NO metric for "game instincts" [6th Tool].
How to "read the bat". "read the ball".
Bob
@Good Knight posted:nick "I’m understanding the size matters issue more than ever."
You don't know how right you are!
My guy is an absolute weight room and metric monster,...and is still a little amazed at the size of the older D1's.
Get your head down and work like a dog!!
That’s the plan.
3B on my son’s travel team is played by a 6’5” 240lb beast committed to a top 25 team. The kid can run and moves incredibly well for that size. He is basically a Power 5 defensive end playing corner infield.
My son was a last cut from varsity as a high school freshman. He was 5’11” 135. He had just had a growth burst. He hadn’t filled out.
It’s all relative. He got to college and realized he had the same issue as when he entered high school. He was 6’1” 175. The game was a lot easier the next season at 6’2” 190.
What helped in college was not burning off the weight playing other sports.
Nick, have you identified the schools your son is targeting yet? If so, look at their rosters and the size of their kids. You'll get an idea of a minimum of what his goals should be. You'd be surprised at how big the kids are even at HA D3 schools.
Very few coaches I've seen have paid much attention, if any, to pop times at a showcase. They want to know if the kid can hit first and play defense second.
@TerribleBPthrower posted:Nick, have you identified the schools your son is targeting yet? If so, look at their rosters and the size of their kids. You'll get an idea of a minimum of what his goals should be. You'd be surprised at how big the kids are even at HA D3 schools.
Very few coaches I've seen have paid much attention, if any, to pop times at a showcase. They want to know if the kid can hit first and play defense second.
We started that process. Engineering/Computer Science major so we started to eliminate that way. D1 is now completely off the table as it’s just not going to happen. Probably won’t bother with D2 either so the pool is getting pretty small. Might revisit if he starts to fill out Junior or Senior year.
I did look at a lot of the rosters to see what the prototype is for the schools. Many just drag the D1 body down. 6’ 200lbs. Also dug into the stats on a lot of the starters and while I understand the want for hitting, most of the catchers are not big hitters. Seems like .230-.250 and maybe a couple of bombs is the norm. Not discounting the difficulty in hitting at any of those levels, but surprised by the lack of production given so much emphasis on size and power.
I’ve got a catcher trapped in the body of a middle infielder. Starting to feel like the second coming of Doug Flutie’s dad.
@Nick0977 posted:We started that process. Engineering/Computer Science major so we started to eliminate that way. D1 is now completely off the table as it’s just not going to happen. Probably won’t bother with D2 either so the pool is getting pretty small. Might revisit if he starts to fill out Junior or Senior year.
I did look at a lot of the rosters to see what the prototype is for the schools. Many just drag the D1 body down. 6’ 200lbs. Also dug into the stats on a lot of the starters and while I understand the want for hitting, most of the catchers are not big hitters. Seems like .230-.250 and maybe a couple of bombs is the norm. Not discounting the difficulty in hitting at any of those levels, but surprised by the lack of production given so much emphasis on size and power.
I’ve got a catcher trapped in the body of a middle infielder. Starting to feel like the second coming of Doug Flutie’s dad.
Everything you are saying is pointing towards D3 for your kid. If you make that decision now, embrace it, and move forward with that goal in mind you will have a leg up on most of your competitors. Assuming you proceed as I described you will have defined the most important variables. Since you know the preferred field of study that (along with location of the school) becomes your primary filter. It won’t be hard to come up with a list of 10-20 schools to focus on. Once you have done that start looking for a contact that has influence with your target schools. And away you go……
Engineering list is pretty short once you cross of D1/D2. We are living it right now. Actually thinking of shifting to a 3/2 or 4/2 program, which was not in the cards a few months ago...
What is a 3/2 & 4/2 program?
Here’s one. There are several good ones.
Your son sounds very versatile to me. That may end up being more valuable than you realize.
@Sue54 posted:Your son sounds very versatile to me. That may end up being more valuable than you realize.
Very helpful. My son will turn 18 in his first few weeks of college. It’s a bit frustrating to think that he won’t add value to a program with his ability behind the plate and versatility because he hasn’t physically matured yet. 145lbs and near zero body fat, he’s building a sold base for what is to come as he gets older and his body allows him to truly pack on muscle.
The attached is from this weekend on his 16u travel team and is an example of the why for my original question. From my experience, there are not a lot of catchers that can also make plays like this. Plays like this are common for him regardless of position. One of the hardest parts is going to be showcasing his athleticism to the right people and not wasting time on those who just won’t care because of his current or potential size. Baseball purists are slow to adapt to what may work better. A great example is the slow shift of MLB clubs to a “money ball” mentality of building a roster. The Rays are on their way to the playoffs again with a very low payroll and a 5’8” catcher. My son trains with and I’ve seen plenty of the standard body types for catchers at showcases. The scouts have a lot to pick from so it’s pretty easy to overlook my son. He’s going to need help to get the visibility and buy in he’ll need.
Thanks again Sue and the rest of you. I truly appreciate your input as it’s going to be far more challenging to find my son a college baseball home than I once thought.
@Nick0977, the video you posted is a good play but not a particularly difficult one. Based on what I see in that video I think it’s too early to prepare a recruiting video. Most likely all you would accomplish is getting your son crossed off the list by his schools of interest. The last thing you want to do is showcase a product that isn’t ready for the marketplace. Every recruiting journey is different and needs to be individually tailored. Since your son is small and young for his grade that translates into “hit the recruiting trail later rather than sooner.” Don’t get caught up in comparing your timeline to other players. Until your son can show playing ability that will catch a coaches eye he is better off training and improving his skills. When the time comes I would focus on camps at schools of interest instead of large, heavily attended showcases. He is way more likely to be noticed at a camp. Just my 2 cents but I have good perspective on this.
@adbono posted:@Nick0977, the video you posted is a good play but not a particularly difficult one. Based on what I see in that video I think it’s too early to prepare a recruiting video. Most likely all you would accomplish is getting your son crossed off the list by his schools of interest. The last thing you want to do is showcase a product that isn’t ready for the marketplace. Every recruiting journey is different and needs to be individually tailored. Since your son is small and young for his grade that translates into “hit the recruiting trail later rather than sooner.” Don’t get caught up in comparing your timeline to other players. Until your son can show playing ability that will catch a coaches eye he is better off training and improving his skills. When the time comes I would focus on camps at schools of interest instead of large, heavily attended showcases. He is way more likely to be noticed at a camp. Just my 2 cents but I have good perspective on this.
Understood and have come to that conclusion as well. He’ll continue to train, eat, train, eat some more and then wait.
……and focus on getting good grades!
Listen to everything Adbono said, and look for a travel team with a coach who has connections and will make calls on his behalf. I wouldn't rely on being found at showcases unless he grows and puts on size. You'd be relying on 1. coaches paying attention 2. opportunities to make great plays coming up while coaches paying attention 3. not being overshadowed by a few stud players putting on a show
My son's travel coach called an Ivy on his behalf and started the process for him. I'm confident without that call there would have been no interest (at least not yet) from the school.
@adbono posted:……and focus on getting good grades!
He is. 3.9 GPA in Computer Science/AP classes. The good news is MIT is D3. I hear they have a decent technology program and even have a 5’6” 165lbs catcher on the roster. So you’re saying there’s a chance… 🤣
Nick;
maybe you can have your son create a computer program for evaluation a pitcher's success on the pitch counts 2-0; 3-1; 3-2. The scorebook can be adjusted to produce a summary.
In addition, maybe your son could play on a '18' & under team to prepare for College.
Bob
Nick,
I found taking my kid to HS games (JV/V) in MS then college games (JuCO, D1-D3) during his freshman year gave him the proper perspective on what the competition looks like and their size. It provided all the motivation needed for the off season work out and training. He went on his official visit (converted to an unofficial visit due to covid restrictions) to his HA D3 on Saturday. He is a 2022 and 16 for another month, his future team mates were impressed with his age but the coaches couldn't care less and told him they expect him to be ready to go when he arrives next fall.
Nick … How tall are you? What kind of physical frame (thick, normal, thin) do you have? For example, I’ve always had a point guard’s frame. At 6’1” I had trouble getting above 180 as an athlete. My son is 6’2”. He has the same frame. He couldn’t get above 175 until college. He got to 195. But he felt more comfortable at 190. How tall is his mother? I’m not going to be rude and ask about her frame.
The thing about being undersized when thinking D1 is they have so many regular or above average players to choose from. When a player is undersized he has to excel to be noticed. It’s more likely to occur competing with potential D3 players. Besides. Unless a kid had the potential to go pro he should be looking for the best education regardless of division.
My kids did go on to play D1 ball. My son was told he was a potential pro prospect was he was sixteen by people who make those decisions for a living. I still held my ground the college decision would new 70% academic and 30% athletic.
It seems that we are all in agreement that that focusing on recruiting at this point is a waste of time and energy. I’m attaching a comprehensive video from last weekend. Not the best plays of the season and not intended to be a recruiting video. Just curious on the thoughts of projectibility given a lot of you have been there. I’ll give his training regimen as well for your thoughts and anything that that might be missing. As Bob recommend, we’ll look into playing up a class in the summers.
15 years old (August) c/o 2024
5’10” 145lbs
3.9 GPA AP/Computer Science Magnet
All training listed is outside of team practices and supervised by professionals.
- Baseball specific strength and conditioning 3X/wk in season, 4X/wk off season
- Facility hitting 3X in season, 4X/wk off season
- Individual Catcher Training 1X On and off season
- Secondary position skills training 2X/wk off season
- Throwing Program/Long toss 3X/wk in season 4X/wk off season
- One month off between seasons. 3X/year
Diet
protein shake morning and night 7X/wk
3 square meals 7X/wk
MetRx Protein bar 2X/day, 5X/wk
Thank you all for your input and guidance. It truly is helpful. Only unbiased evaluation to this point was at a USF camp this summer, scored out as 3/5 or small college prospect. No point in looking further at this point as it’s pretty clear that he’s not big/strong enough to impress anyone important. I’ll check back in a few years to let you know the progress/outcome. Best of luck to you and yours. Thanks for reeling me back in.
Needs to add size. Doubles landing in front of outfielders are not what they want to see. As RJM posted previously, they want to see that the hitting will transfer to the next level of play.
Looks like a good young player. The point that seems to continually be made is no matter how good he moves, he doesn’t yet have the ‘it’ that would induce an urgency from a coach. So be strategic about when to try to engage coaches. Those early commits have ‘it’. You may not see it on a player’s profile but it’s there. So, as you just said, take your time.
Having just gone through this process, one way I like to think about recruiting is what does your kid have that would make the coach seek him out? College rosters have 3-5ish catchers on them. Plenty of proven talent. So what does your kid have that projects him as a starter over said roster? What will he have (I.e. projection)? When that becomes clear, then you make your moves. Before that, enjoy your kid’s excellence in his games. That is how I would think about it. And best of luck.
