Tebow's eye black

OK --- so you like Tim Tebow and what he says. Let's not debate that. Let's back off the religious aspect of Tim Tebow and WHAT it says on his eye black. The issue is, should any athlete use the playing field and the captive audience as a method of sending HIS message (any message) religious or otherwise to those that are watching?
I say no. I like what shortstopmom says:
When individuals go out of their way to make a personal individual statement, I think those antics take away from the perceived visual team unity

Good example of how these very same things can be found right here in this thread! You will find those here on the HSBBW that do exactly as some players do on the field. They want to use this opportunity to send THEIR religious message. There are a lot of differing opinions about how this should be handled and I'll give you mine. I think we have to consider all people and use some sort of guidelines (here and on the field). The HSBBW is great for sharing opinions about what we have in common --- baseball. It's not a good place to share religious opinions. The playing field is a great place to play and enjoy a game ---- period.

quote:

Originally posted by jerseydad:

quote:

Originally posted by Baseballdad1228:
Seeing other people's messages of belief does nothing to change mine, so I don't mind them. Cleveland Dad, however, you might have just created an atheistic bumper sticker!

Sorry to be off topic here but this leads me to wonder...

Do dyslexic atheist ever sit around and wonder if there really is a DOG?

That is not off topic, that is hillarious

quote:

Originally posted by BlueDog:

quote:

Perfect example of my point.

You have no meaningful point, my friend....

quote:

the condescending way you have delivered this message will likely turn many people away.

CPLZ, there is nothing condesending about God's Word.....

Death on Earth is real and short....Eternal life is real and forever.....

Some are so blind they can't see how they offend. I was offended.

quote:

OK --- so you like Tim Tebow and what he says. Let's not debate that. Let's back off the religious aspect of Tim Tebow and WHAT it says on his eye black. The issue is, should any athlete use the playing field and the captive audience as a method of sending HIS message (any message) religious or otherwise to those that are watching?
I say no.

Agreed!

quote:

Do dyslexic atheist ever sit around and wonder if there really is a DOG?

Wow! I go to have lunch with a friend to talk baseball, and when I come back there are nearly five new pages on this topic. It obviously has struck a nerve. I don't have anything specific to add at that moment other than to respond to fillsfan. No, I don't find tattoos offensive in and of themselves. HOWEVER, when they are so pervasive, all over someone's body so that they dominate, yes I do find them offensive. If they want to look like cons who reside in prison, that is something they're free to look like, but I'm also free to not support them, which is one of the main reasons I gave up my season ticekts to the Sacramento Kings 4 years ago.

On another level, as a baseball coach for youth players, I feel it is a responsibility to mentor young men, and like them or not, people who cover themselves in tattoos will find that more of society doesn't appreciate that look when it is extensive, but they think they're cool when they do it. I cannot in good conscience encourage an appearance that will possibly hinder their options later in life. If we make our youth stop and think about some of these things before they do them, then we've done our part. A few tats, not that big of a deal as long as they are in good taste, all over to make you look like an inmate, go live at Folsom Prison for all I care.

quote:

Originally posted by OLDSLUGGER8:
Day game, sunshine, no eye black?

Yesterday, night game?

Helmet, no brim?

OS8 - I just heard about the study you mentioned about eye black the other day where it said without the brim it really does not work all that well and might actually make things worse. Do you think the helmet hanging out over the brow can act like a brim?

It is interesting that in the bright sunshine, he is not wearing any eye black however.

I have never been a fan of any message, anywhere. Writing on sneakers and cleats comes to mind, but I know it is hard to legislate. I am with the camp that says ANYTHING, religious or not which sends an individual message is not good for a team game. The extreme touchdown celebration (T.O.), the home run gate of some, all are theatrics which bring attention to the individual's belief in a message that they believe is worth sending. Biblical writing is just another extension of this same attitude. I am not for it.

Tebow is not the first to place a bible verse on eye black this week....I noticed Ohio State QB Terrell Pryor had a Philippians reference on his eye black.

I like bible verses but even as a professing Christian I think it is a slippery slope on what is allowed on eye black....

On this link they discuss Tebow/Pryor and ask people to comment on what they would put on their eye black....there are some pretty "creative" responses. My favorites were Right/Left and Space/For Rent.

http://www.oregonlive.com/tailgate/index.ssf/2009/01/wh...write_on_your_e.html

OK a little controversy. Politics and Religion, they always cause a rucus on the message board.

God is great!

Nothing to do with the original subject and hope no one thinks I’m committing a sin.

I’ve always found it disturbing when normal human beings try to use God to “frighten” other normal human beings into sharing their beliefs. The intent might be for all the right reasons, but religious beliefs are not the same everywhere in this world. We should respect others while still maintaining our own beliefs. There should be no warnings coming from normal human beings. That is my sermon for the day!

Please forgive me. For I know not what I do.

All atheists become believers when they die on Earth.....

quote:

I’ve always found it disturbing when normal human beings try to use God to “frighten” other normal human beings into sharing their beliefs.

Just how does this happen, PG?

quote:

I’ve always found it disturbing when normal human beings try to use God to “frighten” other normal human beings into sharing their beliefs.

Like this? All atheists become believers when they die on Earth.....

I agree.

quote:

Originally posted by PGStaff:
OK a little controversy. Politics and Religion, they always cause a rucus on the message board.

God is great!

Nothing to do with the original subject and hope no one thinks I’m committing a sin.

I’ve always found it disturbing when normal human beings try to use God to “frighten” other normal human beings into sharing their beliefs. The intent might be for all the right reasons, but religious beliefs are not the same everywhere in this world. We should respect others while still maintaining our own beliefs. There should be no warnings coming from normal human beings. That is my sermon for the day!

Please forgive me. For I know not what I do.

My views are the same as yours.

I have found that spirituality is what I am fond of and not religion. I am a Christian who believes in the bible but I don't believe I was put on the earth to "save" people with my words. Actions on the other hand speak much louder in my view. For example, I don't need the national media praising my good works. God knows what I do (in secret) and that is more than good enough for me.

I agree with Fungo. I don't think the hsbbweb is a great place for religion although I think this is a great topic. I feel the same way about politics. This is a fun site and I hate to see it mucked up with those things that should not be discussed at a party.

Every now and then, a topic is started for one of our members who is in dire need and may need some spiritual, religious, or other type of comforting support. I think these are valid exceptions however where people can express their genuine support for someone who is suffering. The exception does not justify a broader rule imho.

quote:

Originally posted by BlueDog:
All atheists become believers when they die on Earth.....

Who told you that? For a religion that believes in forgiveness and love you can be very dismissive of others beliefs. I would recommend everyone worry about their own life and after life and leave others to belief what they want. How about if your the ones disappointed when you die. Wouldn't that be something!

06catchersdad,
I respect your decision to give up your tickets for what you believe. However, prisoners aren't the only ones with multiple tattoos. Many artists and musicians are tattooed, and where would we be without them.

I decided long ago not to judge someone by their tattoos, hair color, dress or piercings. But I will judge someone who dismisses my beliefs if they are different than theirs.

Before any of you start saying that I am hating on Tim Tebow I want to make it clear I think he is very talented. I am not a UF fan but I respect the program and what they have accomplished.

But..... I am about sick of all this stuff. The entire game "Superman" "He went on a trip to ......... and .......... and he ministers to kids and .......... and ............!"

I thought it was a football game? It ends up being a commercial on Tim Tebow. Can we just play the game for Petes sake? Can we talk about football? Then he is out there trying to send his messages with the eye black. The guy is going to end up being a politician no doubt.

OU has some great kids too you know. UF has some great kids as well you know. Talk about hyping something into the ground and breaking it off. Enough.

quote:

For a religion that believes in forgiveness and love you can be very dismissive of others beliefs.

From a mixed marriage our kids have been exposed to both religions. I've attended church on a regular basis. With a good speaker the message can be intellectually stimulating regardless of the religion.

I found the most critical, backstabbing people were the inner circle of the church. They were even critical of the two pastors behind their backs.

What I find fascinating is being told I pray to a false god because I don't believe in Jesus. My god is the same god they worship.

quote:

Originally posted by Coach May:
Before any of you start saying that I am hating on Tim Tebow I want to make it clear I think he is very talented. I am not a UF fan but I respect the program and what they have accomplished.

But..... I am about sick of all this stuff. The entire game "Superman" "He went on a trip to ......... and .......... and he ministers to kids and .......... and ............!"

I thought it was a football game? It ends up being a commercial on Tim Tebow. Can we just play the game for Petes sake? Can we talk about football? Then he is out there trying to send his messages with the eye black. The guy is going to end up being a politician no doubt.

OU has some great kids too you know. UF has some great kids as well you know. Talk about hyping something into the ground and breaking it off. Enough.

I turned off the tv as soon as the game ended. I was tired of the constant adulation. I wasn't going to watch Tebow advertise his religion in a post game interview. One person's testifying is in your face promotion to another person.

The only time I was happy to hear Jesus talk in a post game interview was when I bet someone $20 Kurt Warner would say "Jesus" before the words "team" or "Rams" in his post Super Bowl interview.

quote:

Originally posted by Coach May:
I thought it was a football game? It ends up being a commercial on Tim Tebow.

I think there is more here than what appears on the surface.

If you watched the other bowl games, we got dozens of shots of Colt McCoys parents, Chase Daniels parents, and lots of talk about these two. It came at the expense of every other player in the contest with so much attention focused on one individual. It seems as though the networks have a formula whereby they are trying to sell us a story line so that we have some form of attachment and identification with the player and his family.

Like you, I'm sick of it too.

quote:

But..... I am about sick of all this stuff. The entire game "Superman" "He went on a trip to ......... and .......... and he ministers to kids and .......... and ............!"

Tebow is outstanding and I agree with you completely. I'm not sure it's his fault though! Then again, he does seem to enjoy it.

I'll go back to my original thought. No matter how he does in Pro Football or anything else. No matter whether someone thinks he's the greatest or not. This kid is one unbelievable fierce competitor. And you have to appreciate that!

quote:

Originally posted by Coach May:
Before any of you start saying that I am hating on Tim Tebow I want to make it clear I think he is very talented. I am not a UF fan but I respect the program and what they have accomplished.

But..... I am about sick of all this stuff. The entire game "Superman" "He went on a trip to ......... and .......... and he ministers to kids and .......... and ............!"

I thought it was a football game? It ends up being a commercial on Tim Tebow. Can we just play the game for Petes sake? Can we talk about football? Then he is out there trying to send his messages with the eye black. The guy is going to end up being a politician no doubt.

OU has some great kids too you know. UF has some great kids as well you know. Talk about hyping something into the ground and breaking it off. Enough.

You are singing to the choir Coach May. The same people who are building him up will be the same ones tearing him down someday. I think it was Steve Garvey who had the wholesome, All-American image until he went through a nasty divorce and then the media turned on him. I watch sports to get away from the serious grind of life that we all must go though every day. There is a time and a place for everything.

Here is a piece from Ecclesiastes chapter 3:

quote:

A time to give birth and a time to die;
A time to plant and a time to uproot what is planted.

A time to kill and a time to heal;
A time to tear down and a time to build up.

A time to weep and a time to laugh;
A time to mourn and a time to dance.

A time to throw stones and a time to gather stones;
A time to embrace and a time to shun embracing.

A time to search and a time to give up as lost;
A time to keep and a time to throw away.

A time to tear apart and a time to sew together;
A time to be silent and a time to speak.

A time to love and a time to hate;
A time for war and a time for peace.

Cleveland ... Someone should turn that into a song.

quote:

Originally posted by RJM:
Cleveland ... Someone should turn that concept into a song.

Ask and ye shall recieve:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nUworKXBzdE

Fungo, look what you've gone and done now!

We've all got to hand it to Fungo. He sure has a knack for starting topics that get people's attention and make us think. I'm not sure anyone can come up with as many popular topics as Fungo.

Perhaps retirement just gives him too much time on his hands to think?

quote:

Originally posted by 06catcherdad:
Fungo, look what you've gone and done now!

We've all got to hand it to Fungo. He sure has a knack for starting topics that get people's attention and make us think. I'm not sure anyone can come up with as many popular topics as Fungo.

Nobody does it better

quote:

Originally posted by CPLZ:

If you watched the other bowl games, we got dozens of shots of Colt McCoys parents, Chase Daniels parents, and lots of talk about these two.

Did any one else read Mrs. Daniels lips when Chase bobbled the ball in overtime right before throwing the touchdown pass? We watched it in slow motion several times and got a good chuckle.

OOPS, I went to modify my post and accidently deleted it. It was long winded anyway.

Fungo, I do agree you have very thought provocking posts. I am enjoying them while I am out of school.

quote:

If his religion espoused killing others for having different beliefs like some do, then I'd have a problem with it.

Check with the Native Americans, the ones who are left anyway, how they feel about this.

Bob Dylan wrote a great song (my favorite cover is by the Neville Brothers) which I'll post the lyrics to here and then leave this thread behind lest I make enemies of friends (something that religion has a way of doing):

With God On Our Side
Oh my name it is nothin'
My age it means less
The country I come from
Is called the Midwest
I's taught and brought up there
The laws to abide
And that land that I live in
Has God on its side.

Oh the history books tell it
They tell it so well
The cavalries charged
The Indians fell
The cavalries charged
The Indians died
Oh the country was young
With God on its side.

Oh the Spanish-American
War had its day
And the Civil War too
Was soon laid away
And the names of the heroes
I's made to memorize
With guns in their hands
And God on their side.

Oh the First World War, boys
It closed out its fate
The reason for fighting
I never got straight
But I learned to accept it
Accept it with pride
For you don't count the dead
When God's on your side.

When the Second World War
Came to an end
We forgave the Germans
And we were friends
Though they murdered six million
In the ovens they fried
The Germans now too
Have God on their side.

I've learned to hate Russians
All through my whole life
If another war starts
It's them we must fight
To hate them and fear them
To run and to hide
And accept it all bravely
With God on my side.

But now we got weapons
Of the chemical dust
If fire them we're forced to
Then fire them we must
One push of the button
And a shot the world wide
And you never ask questions
When God's on your side.

In a many dark hour
I've been thinkin' about this
That Jesus Christ
Was betrayed by a kiss
But I can't think for you
You'll have to decide
Whether Judas Iscariot
Had God on his side.

So now as I'm leavin'
I'm weary as Hell
The confusion I'm feelin'
Ain't no tongue can tell
The words fill my head
And fall to the floor
If God's on our side
He'll stop the next war.

Coach May,
I agree with you, this a.m. on talk show they were talking about how they would love to see the Dolphins take some of those OU players.
I think that Tebow is a great role model and a fierce competitor but the game is not all dependent on one person. So enough with the superman stuff.

PG,
You are really funny.

Just a bit off topic here, but is anyone else reminded of Steve Young? Tebow would look great in Red and Gold, and I'd bet he'd love playing for Singletary.

Here comes the devils advocate.

He's a smart kid but maybe Tebow is playing a "game within the game". We all know being the medias darling puts you in a very opportunistic situation in regard to your future. The UF Athletic Dept would be more than happy to help him as much press as possible. I'm not saying he's a bad apple, but even good apples can have worms.

I also thought it was media overkill but it still takes a distant second to the AJ Hawk - Brady Quinn and his sister love fest a few years ago. That girl got more free air time than anyone in History.

I commend those that have posted on this topic. While I never intended it to be a pro or con "religious" thread I think just about everyone has expressed their feelings about religion and how it impacts their lives on and off the playing field without offending anyone else. We have disagreed in a way that should make us proud of ourselves. I'm doubly impressed since this time of year we all have a touch of cabin fever, complicated by baseball withdrawals. Hang in there. Baseball is just around the corner!. I do appreciate everyones input.
Fungo

quote:

Originally posted by spizzlepop:
Just a bit off topic here, but is anyone else reminded of Steve Young?

Not so much. Making a token effort at staying on topic, I'll suggest that Steve Young, who has strong religious beliefs, would not place a religous message on his face. I think he well understands CPLZ's point about effectiveness of the message.

With respect to football, Young was much smaller, much faster (reputed to be the fastest 49er every year he played), and had a stronger and more accurate arm. Both players are receptive to contact, and Tebow is pretty massive for a quarterback. BYU nearly made Steve Young play safety. I'd guess that Tebow's alternate position would be tight end.

Its so funny to me. I was eating out tonight with my wife and Sports Center was on. I couldnt help but catch the headlines "Tim Tebows Top Ten Moments". Then a congrats to Tim on winning the National Championship.

Let me be the next to congratulate Tim Tebow on the National Championship. By the way what team won it this year?

I sure miss the days when you turned on the big game and the guys were talking about the o-line and how they matched up against the other d-line. What defense each team ran and who the teams stacked up against one another. During the game they talked about the game. The plays that were and were not made. Coaching decisions etc. Now we have constant shots of the family members in the stands. Celebs on the sidelines. Constant pumping of the guys they want to pump. Human interest stories. If I wanted to watch a bunch of Human interest stories I would watch the Olympics.

Ok enough for me Slugger is right time to move on.

Tebow's eye black doesnt bother me but I wonder if he had a Ford Truck decal and the NCAA game sponsor was Chevrolet, would they come up with a speedy rule?

I kinda like Tebow but after watching all the "up close and personal" stories about him for the last couple years I have to wonder if their isn't a PR machine behind him.

Last night I found myself thinking, this kid has a political office written all over him.

quote:

Originally posted by Double Eagle:
I have never been a fan of any message, anywhere. Writing on sneakers and cleats comes to mind, ...

Your wife must not have seen the humor in your little joke.

quote:

I wonder if he had a Ford Truck decal and the NCAA game sponsor was Chevrolet, would they come up with a speedy rule?

There is a rule against NCAA athletes endorsing products. He would be suspended.

Sam Bradford, Oklahoma quarterback.....

quote:

"The key things I've learned are patience, perseverance and trusting God...."Everything that God does He's doing for a reason. He has a purpose and we need to trust Him and know that His plan is the right way."

Texas quarterback, Colt McCoy talking about Tebow....

quote:

"Tim understands, we're here for a reason," said McCoy, the Heisman runnerup. "God has blessed us. He has given us the ability to play, to compete. And we just want to be a light for him out there."

Tebow....

quote:

“Doing those things, taking my platform as a football player and using it to be an influence and change peoples’ lives — that’s more important than football to me.”

quote:

"Everybody is telling me I’ve made it,” Tebow told the inmates. “They tell me, ‘Tim, you have success and you’ve made it.’ I’ve won the Heisman Trophy, so I’ve got it made, right? One day, people are going to forget about me. One day, people are going to forget about the Heisman Trophy, the jump pass and the national championship. One day, this [championship] ring is going to rust. There are only four things that are going to last forever: God, his word, people and rewards.

These guys should be role models, IMO....Not Bob Dylan or George Carlin.....

Tebow has not promoted any Religion, at all.....Anyone saying he is promoting a Religion is wrong....