I went to a baseball discussion and a COVID brawl broke out ...
The point is, many D3 conferences will likely not have spring sports - some have already cancelled. So, the NCAA has already given the athletes back their eligibility. I think it does encourage other conferences to cancel also. And so yes, that means that rosters are going to be very packed at some schools, some (many?) athletes may take the spring semester off - why pay for online classes and no sports?
Putting aside the CNN/Fox dichotomy for a moment (and who's watching too much of either of them) what is the NCAA basing its decisions on?
@anotherparent posted:The point is, many D3 conferences will likely not have spring sports - some have already cancelled. So, the NCAA has already given the athletes back their eligibility. I think it does encourage other conferences to cancel also. And so yes, that means that rosters are going to be very packed at some schools, some (many?) athletes may take the spring semester off - why pay for online classes and no sports?
I'm trying to get my son to understand that. I know I can flat out tell him, but I'd rather he get there on his own.
@smokeminside posted:Putting aside the CNN/Fox dichotomy for a moment (and who's watching too much of either of them) what is the NCAA basing its decisions on?
On the fact that some conferences have already cancelled spring, and others are likely to do the same.
The question really is, when are these conferences going to make decisions about spring sports? Before or after Christmas break? If they bring students back and then cancel, that would be ugly.
Big NESCAC meeting on Nov. 12. Possibly know then for them.
On Fri, Oct 30, 2020 at 12:09 PM HS Baseball Web <alerts@crowdstack.com>
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On Fri, Oct 30, 2020 at 12:09 PM HS Baseball Web <alerts@crowdstack.com>
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@Smitty28 posted:You're watching too much CNN. 97% of the population have not gotten Covid, and of those who did the vast, vast majority (98%) haven't died or suffered any serious issues, and those that have were mostly old people.
CNN. As if. Look, it is really very simple:
The NCAA & Trump are not on the same page. Without a change in how we deal with the pandemic, the NCAA is not going to allow sports “as normal”. That is clear based on the reality of the NCAA’s decision making process so far.
The main thing is that “wishing” or “hoping” isn’t going to make the NCAA change its stance!
You might say “well I think the NCAA is being dumb”. OK, congrats to you, you successfully expressed an opinion. That won’t buy you a cup of coffee but hey, hey, good for you.
I’d rather deal with facts, not opinions. The fact is, without a change in how we deal with the pandemic, the NCAA isn’t allowing sports to get played as normal.
The NCAA is not saying anything about whether sports can be played. That's schools and conferences. The NCAA is simply saying that students get an extra year of eligibility. Maybe that encourages conferences to cancel, but it's not saying they have to.
It was the same for D1 football, it was up to the conferences. In fact it's the presidents of colleges who are being cautious, or not, depending on their individual and local circumstances. And even conferences are being constrained by the state laws, in many cases, even when the schools would rather do things differently. Even there, schools could lobby their local governments differently than they are, and that IS a choice.
@RJM posted:I went to a baseball discussion and a COVID brawl broke out ...
At least you picked the right team!
@anotherparent posted:The question really is, when are these conferences going to make decisions about spring sports? Before or after Christmas break? If they bring students back and then cancel, that would be ugly.
This is key. I know many players that will skip the Spring semester if still online AND no baseball, my son included.
@smokeminside posted:Putting aside the CNN/Fox dichotomy for a moment (and who's watching too much of either of them) what is the NCAA basing its decisions on?
fear, stupidity, wokeness....general over reaction without rational thought process.
We are going to spend the thanksgiving/xmas break this year hashing out the future for our son. A SR at a HA D3 -- he will graduate in May. Last two years of college ball pulled out from under him. That is a hard pill to swallow for anyone. Wondering if he'll do grad school and play or if he will just hang it up and move on. He is going to be a high school teacher -- and wants to coach. It will be very interesting to see how his thought process plays out.
@MAM posted:We are going to spend the thanksgiving/xmas break this year hashing out the future for our son. A SR at a HA D3 -- he will graduate in May. Last two years of college ball pulled out from under him. That is a hard pill to swallow for anyone. Wondering if he'll do grad school and play or if he will just hang it up and move on. He is going to be a high school teacher -- and wants to coach. It will be very interesting to see how his thought process plays out.
When son hung up the cleats he went back to finish school and was a student assistant with the baseball team. He loved it!
If he really wants to be a teacher and a coach and wants his master's degree, he should look into being a grad assistant somewhere or at his alma mater. He can still be a part of the game.
After approximately 9 years of pro ball, he hasnt looked back once.
MAM, I feel so bad for your son and the other college seniors. This slow-rolling disaster was so unexpected and is so painful. I hope he finds a good solution; getting the extra eligibility doesn't make up for the loss of the years.
Sorry, MAM, I feel you. Lots of families will be having similar conversations, including ours. It sucks.
@anotherparent posted:On the fact that some conferences have already cancelled spring, and others are likely to do the same.
The question really is, when are these conferences going to make decisions about spring sports? Before or after Christmas break? If they bring students back and then cancel, that would be ugly.
The problem is that colleges have to basically decide now on what they will do for the spring. And, they don't want to say "100% on campus in the spring" now and then deal with the backlash 3 months down the road or so when they may have to pivot to virtual and remote learning. Doing that on a dime is loaded with problems. So, you're going to see schools now say "we're remote in the spring and no spring sports." It seems inevitable, unfortunately. And, the baseball players are going to get hosed two years in a row in some states. That all said, I sincerely pray that I am wrong on this and there is college baseball in 2021.
@Francis7 posted:The problem is that colleges have to basically decide now on what they will do for the spring. And, they don't want to say "100% on campus in the spring" now and then deal with the backlash 3 months down the road or so when they may have to pivot to virtual and remote learning. Doing that on a dime is loaded with problems. So, you're going to see schools now say "we're remote in the spring and no spring sports." It seems inevitable, unfortunately. And, the baseball players are going to get hosed two years in a row in some states. That all said, I sincerely pray that I am wrong on this and there is college baseball in 2021.
I don't know about D3, but D1 schools and many D2 as well as Juco, give students options, remote or in class instruction. Because of this though, testing is essential, and some programs just cannot afford the expense.
As far as athletics, many teams are practicing, and playing (football).
Coaches and admins have fought so hard to keep players safe, but this current wave is now out of control. Football teams missing players they have depended upon. So with that in mind, it's really hard to tell what will be come January.
And deaths continue to be level or decrease. We've gotten much better at treating. The biggest issue will be over reacting and shutting down things. We can and have to learn to live with this.
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I must be dreaming because I swore I watched all the major conferences play football today. Maybe I need to wake up from this dream. If football can play, why can't baseball until 2023 or 2024? I know no one who was not already critically facing another illness that has died from Covid. Yes it and the flu will cause many to die this winter who already had something. I'm not saying it does not happen but it was already happening and the number of total deaths in the US for year are not drastically up. And if you think sleepy Joe who can't remember who he is running against and his running mate who does not even know where she is can fix this mess any better then we have more problems than Covid.
@3and2Fastball posted:I think you have that backwards. If he wins, there won’t be a full Baseball season until 2023 or 2024. Unchecked, the virus will be killing 5,000 people or more a day, or 5,000 to 15,000 per week at least. Schools won’t feel safe to be open or playing sports. Any sort of vaccine, if safe, is a good 18-24 months away from being fully distributed enough to effectively work across the full nation.
I actually think Old School is right on this one. If Trump loses the election I think the likelihood of baseball in the spring becomes remote.
Football plays because $ say so.
Basketball will try, but be shut down by January end.
There will be no baseball in February, because there is no plan to deal with the coming winter flu season on top of the covid junk.
There may be baseball played in April and May. If the screwed up budgets don't override the desire.
Everybody gets 3 years back so they can play until age 29.
MLB see the success (defined by $) of the pay to play model for short season A ball . (Those teams that were eliminated in MiLB contraction who went to college wood bat league format.) MLB expands the model to High A level, with eyes on eventually eliminating AA as well.
And then the cycle is complete.
I don't think that schools can't play goes across the board. Some of you are only looking at your level of ball, which may be my observation. From my research, talking to players at various schools, 75% of players at 6 P5 schools for baseball have tested positive for Covid so there is very little chance that the number of people will be too high. i do think that the P5 schools will play this spring but who knows on some of the other levels. I think they will find a way to make it work. I would love to know what % of players at the schools that are consistently testing have tested positive. This will be the determining factor of what schools will play.
Well, this thread is about D3 schools. Not about COVID, not about the election, but about the fact that D3 athletes have been given another year of eligibility. We all know that, as they always do, P5 schools have put money ahead of the "student athlete" concept. Letting sports continue when students are banned from campus (e.g. UNC) is a mockery. The pandemic is making the differences between levels very stark. Doesn't mean that D3 kids don't want to play ball in the spring just as much as D1 kids.
D3 ballplayers adjusting to COVID 19.
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D3 schools are the least likely to play baseball in the spring. You can debate all you want, and/or cite all the reasons it should not be - but it’s a fact. And the more liberal the school, the more likely they won’t play. It’s already been proven by the actions to date.
I don't disagree with the first point you make, Adbono. Regarding the 2nd, my son's school would not doubt count as liberal in your book, but if they are allowed to play, I'm convinced they will play. They take athletics very seriously. But it's not up to them. It's up to the state, the county, and their conference, in that order.
@JCG posted:I don't disagree with the first point you make, Adbono. Regarding the 2nd, my son's school would not doubt count as liberal in your book, but if they are allowed to play, I'm convinced they will play. They take athletics very seriously. But it's not up to them. It's up to the state, the county, and their conference, in that order.
That’s a fair point. A conservative school in a liberal state, in a conference with liberal schools may have limited say regarding their own fate. But IMO it’s been proven that baseball can be played safely. So if states & conferences decide they aren’t going to play baseball this spring it’s because they don’t want to.
If they are making the decision (whether from choice or local mandate) to bring only some students to live on campus, then having sports becomes very difficult. Even the most liberal schools are in extreme financial hardship because of this situation. They don't want to be having to do this.
I don't think it's that they can't afford sports, nor that they don't want to have them - it's that these are mostly schools where 95% of students live in dorms on campus. They think, or the state thinks, that they can't bring everyone back to the dorms. There's not enough off-campus accomodation nearby, and therefore how would they even test the off-campus people? How would you manage if half the team was in the dorms being tested all the time, and the other half wasn't?
@TPM posted:Is it that they dont want to or that they cant afford to?
You could probably make a case for either excuse. It saves the school money if they don’t play so IMO that would be why they don’t want to. But I’m sure they would not state that publicly.
@anotherparent posted:If they are making the decision (whether from choice or local mandate) to bring only some students to live on campus, then having sports becomes very difficult. Even the most liberal schools are in extreme financial hardship because of this situation. They don't want to be having to do this.
I don't think it's that they can't afford sports, nor that they don't want to have them - it's that these are mostly schools where 95% of students live in dorms on campus. They think,
or the state thinks, that they can't bring everyone back to the dorms. There's not enough off-campus accomodation nearby, and therefore how would they even test the off-campus people? How would you manage if half the team was in the dorms being tested all the time, and the other half wasn't?
THIS
I also agree that it's BS that a way to play can't be figured out. Athletics just isn't a high priority at these schools even though in my sons' cases 35% of the student body at one school are D3 athletes, and the other school has a student body that's 20% D3 athletes.
The impetus to play has to come from the players and the coaches but a difficult situation seems to be getting worse.
Has there been any talk of spring baseball leagues that players can join? A few travel organizations in FL have talked about putting something together if the HS season is shut down.
@Francis7 posted:Two things to consider:
1. There are MANY kids, period, who need more than 4 years to get their bachelor's degree. I thought that I read somewhere recently that it's not unreasonable to expect a kid these days to need 4 1/2 years.
2. Never underestimate the hopes and dreams factor. Look at how many seniors in college last year are coming back for another year this year. I thought almost no one would do it for all the logical reasons. But, it seems like most are doing it for the illogical reason.
@Francis7 I did 4 1/2 years in the 80's, but then again, the college I went to cost 3k for the entire year. Paid my own way after freshmen year because I messed up the spring semester of the freshman year.
Not focused, played Baseball, student lounge. etc.
Results 4 D's and a B.
Mother said I was a bad return on her investment.
Real talk.
Your mom was awesome
@old_school posted:Your mom was awesome
I talk about this lesson all the time.
Had to work at the Port Authority bus terminal as a red cap (moving passenger luggage) for 4 years, Worked the 4 - 12 shift.
For those that know NYC, the Port Authority is near Times Square, at the time, Time Square still had the smell of xxx.
Saw a lot of stuff, made me focus.
@CollegebaseballInsights posted:I talk about this lesson all the time.
Had to work at the Port Authority bus terminal as a red cap (moving passenger luggage) for 4 years, Worked the 4 - 12 shift.
For those that know NYC, the Port Authority is near Times Square, at the time, Time Square still had the smell of xxx.
Saw a lot of stuff, made me focus.
How'd you like The Deuce?
@SoCal OG posted:This is key. I know many players that will skip the Spring semester if still online AND no baseball, my son included.
I'm hearing that if the SCIAC plays there will be no spectators. 
As for skipping the spring, I don't know how it is at other schools, and obviously every family's situation is different, but last I heard there can be a severe financial cost if you do that at my son's school. Apparently the expected family contribution remains the same regardless of how many semesters you attend during an academic year. So if the total cost of attendance is $60K and your EFC is $30K, then you get a $30K award for the year, and you pay $30K. But if you do two semesters in two years, your EFC is $30K, and so is your TCA, so your FA award is $0 for each of the two years. And of course the kid is giving up one year's worth of earnings, though that could be moot in this economy.
@JCG posted:I'm hearing that if the SCIAC plays there will be no spectators.
As for skipping the spring, I don't know how it is at other schools, and obviously every family's situation is different, but last I heard there can be a severe financial cost if you do that at my son's school. Apparently the expected family contribution remains the same regardless of how many semesters you attend during an academic year. So if the total cost of attendance is $60K and your EFC is $30K, then you get a $30 award for the year, and you pay $30K. But if you do two semesters in two years, your EFC is $30K, and so is your TCA, so your FA award is $0 for each of the two years. And of course the kid is giving up one year's worth of earnings, though that could be moot in this economy.
Santa will have to leave me a really nice set of binoculars in my stocking then!
Good point about finances...not sure how many have looked that far yet.