This issue comes up from time to time. In my opinion, 22 kids for the roster is probably not a big deal if those who are unlikely to get much playing time are content with their diminished role. And many of those will likely be seniors who stuck with the program for 4 years (and yes, they should be allowed to stay on the team).
In a really competitive baseball district, 22 might be necessary, with many POs (including inning burners when up or down big), etc.
We have too many seniors this year, but I've only cut 2 so far. They have till scrimmages end for the "final" cut. I likely won't cut anymore, though simply by talent I probably should.
To me the key to pulling it off is two-fold: solid communication of what their role will be and the ability to cut them mid-season if grumbling begins.
I plan on telling 3 kids that they will likely never cross the lines. They'll get a jersey during the season, but will likely give it up for the playoffs (they'll wear a BP top) so I can give it to a callup kid who might play. They are expected to be at every practice and workout and find a way to make a positive contribution on a regular basis. If they can't handle all of that they need to turn in their stuff.
These are good kids who have been with us for 4-years, they're good friends with the team and want to see their friends succeed, so I think we can pull it off.
I've been down the grumpy senior road in the past, and it can kill a team, but I may not have communicated as thoroughly as I am now.
If negativity begins to creep in, kids will be removed. No hesitation. And I'm getting much better at cutting kids their Junior year to avoid this circus.
Batty67 posted:And many of those will likely be seniors who stuck with the program for 4 years (and yes, they should be allowed to stay on the team).
Do you let them letter? Here, even if you don't play, if you stick with the team for four years, you letter.
We have that many on Fresh JV and Varsity teams at least, most years. Some years we have to add a fourth team (Jr-Soph team) to account for good sophs who were not going to get playing time on Varsity but who needed to play against better competition to improve. We have many kids who are POs and others who are specialty players. We play a lot of games and we need pitchers to eat up innings so that our top tier pitchers dont get worn out before playoffs.
The kids know this coming in as Freshman and they know they must compete each week for playing time. Practices are intense and competitive and many times harder than some of the games. By the time playoffs are here we have fresh pitchers and our boys are ready for playoff level baseball.
It is true that some boys will only get minimal ABs and PT but many stay around for the comradery.The team chemistry is very good despite the competition for playing time at every position.
IRONHORSE wrote, "If negativity creeps in, kids will be removed. No hesitation. And I'm getting much better at cutting kids their Junior year to avoid this circus."
IMO this is how to handle the concerns expressed in the OP. Agree 100%
VS roster is 28 and has been since the beginning. It helps with fundraising. LOL
The talent depth has a lot to do with it. If you split our roster in half I wouldn't be surprised if the the second half won over half of their games.
Senior starter strikes out.
Senior benchwarmer #1 mutters, "I could've done that."
Senior benchwarmer #2 mutters, "Me too."
Ass't coach yells, "Somebody on that foul ball!"
Senior benchwarmer #1 replies, "I'm on it coach!"
i Just think keeping seniors on a team “because they have been with us 4 years” is sending the wrong message. Son’s HS has a senior class with 13 players, three of two of whom were never varsity guys - ever. Should they get a roster spot just to keep them happy, or their parents, or to help with fundraisIng? That is a big point here because many programs have these kids make donations or solicit donations to help fund the programs prior to cuts. Now that Johnny’s Family has “carried the water” financially it seems he gets a jersey as a participation award. That doesn’t sound like competitive baseball to me, it sounds like if you fundraise and hang on long enough you get a jersey. That is Rec league crap.
I see all points, but let's settle down on acting like keeping a senior who won't play much is akin to rampant entitlement. This is HIGH SCHOOL baseball and for a lot of my kids this is the pinnacle of their athletic career. This generally impacts only 2 or 3 kids every couple of years.
And in my mind I'm not simply giving a kid a spot. In our program we emphasize character, being a good student/citizen, and being a good player. If a kid can do the first two of those (which isn't as easy as it may seems sometimes), then I'm ok with letting him be on the team and enjoy the experience, assuming he is a positive force. He's earned by 3 years of hard work and buy in.
Playing time will never be given based on just being on the team, but a good kid who's invested can still contribute in a ton of ways.
Don't underestimate the different layers that go into deciding on a varsity roster if you've never done it. It looks easy until you're make the decisions rather than suggestions.
freddy77 posted:Senior starter strikes out.
Senior benchwarmer #1 mutters, "I could've done that."
Senior benchwarmer #2 mutters, "Me too."
Ass't coach yells, "Somebody on that foul ball!"
Senior benchwarmer #1 replies, "I'm on it coach!"
We had this last year. My son was a junior and never sat. Many seniors never played, and he knew they complained about it. But he didn't LISTEN to them, and it didn't IMPACT him.
Kids who know what they want and are busy going after it, don't have time to worry about what other people say or do.
ironhorse posted:I see all points, but let's settle down on acting like keeping a senior who won't play much is akin to rampant entitlement. This is HIGH SCHOOL baseball and for a lot of my kids this is the pinnacle of their athletic career. This generally impacts only 2 or 3 kids every couple of years.
And in my mind I'm not simply giving a kid a spot. In our program we emphasize character, being a good student/citizen, and being a good player. If a kid can do the first two of those (which isn't as easy as it may seems sometimes), then I'm ok with letting him be on the team and enjoy the experience, assuming he is a positive force. He's earned by 3 years of hard work and buy in.
Playing time will never be given based on just being on the team, but a good kid who's invested can still contribute in a ton of ways.
Don't underestimate the different layers that go into deciding on a varsity roster if you've never done it. It looks easy until you're make the decisions rather than suggestions.
Ding, Ding, Ding !!!! Yes, this!
ironhorse posted:We have too many seniors this year, but I've only cut 2 so far. They have till scrimmages end for the "final" cut. I likely won't cut anymore, though simply by talent I probably should.
To me the key to pulling it off is two-fold: solid communication of what their role will be and the ability to cut them mid-season if grumbling begins.
I plan on telling 3 kids that they will likely never cross the lines. They'll get a jersey during the season, but will likely give it up for the playoffs (they'll wear a BP top) so I can give it to a callup kid who might play. They are expected to be at every practice and workout and find a way to make a positive contribution on a regular basis. If they can't handle all of that they need to turn in their stuff.
These are good kids who have been with us for 4-years, they're good friends with the team and want to see their friends succeed, so I think we can pull it off.
I've been down the grumpy senior road in the past, and it can kill a team, but I may not have communicated as thoroughly as I am now.
If negativity begins to creep in, kids will be removed. No hesitation. And I'm getting much better at cutting kids their Junior year to avoid this circus.
I've always had a hard time understanding how a HS kid at the bottom of the roster would never receive playing time. Aren't there usually a few blow out games either way where you could throw the kid a bone?
To me, if the kid works hard and has a positive attitude, they should be rewarded in these types of situations.
I agree and I've seen it way too many times. Kid works hard all season, parents do their part with all of the volunteer stuff, the team has a large lead and the kid sits on the bench. It's one of the main reasons I am not a fan of HS baseball around here.
Daily inter squad games use double DH, 6 outs per inning for the players to receive many AB's. If you are inside with batting tunnels have team pitchers [use pitching screen]; throw to a catcher and hitter. Grade the batted ball as out, hit, hit hard, pop up. When not hitting, play pepper with tennis balls.
Bob
rynoattack posted:ironhorse posted:We have too many seniors this year, but I've only cut 2 so far. They have till scrimmages end for the "final" cut. I likely won't cut anymore, though simply by talent I probably should.
To me the key to pulling it off is two-fold: solid communication of what their role will be and the ability to cut them mid-season if grumbling begins.
I plan on telling 3 kids that they will likely never cross the lines. They'll get a jersey during the season, but will likely give it up for the playoffs (they'll wear a BP top) so I can give it to a callup kid who might play. They are expected to be at every practice and workout and find a way to make a positive contribution on a regular basis. If they can't handle all of that they need to turn in their stuff.
These are good kids who have been with us for 4-years, they're good friends with the team and want to see their friends succeed, so I think we can pull it off.
I've been down the grumpy senior road in the past, and it can kill a team, but I may not have communicated as thoroughly as I am now.
If negativity begins to creep in, kids will be removed. No hesitation. And I'm getting much better at cutting kids their Junior year to avoid this circus.
I've always had a hard time understanding how a HS kid at the bottom of the roster would never receive playing time. Aren't there usually a few blow out games either way where you could throw the kid a bone?
To me, if the kid works hard and has a positive attitude, they should be rewarded in these types of situations.
^That’s exactly what our HC did last season.
adbono posted:Larger Varsity rosters seem to be the trend & I think it does nothing but cause problems. All 22 kids think they should be on the field regardless of their level of ability - and so do their parents. Last time I checked only 9 play at one time so there is no way to get every player involved no matter how creative Coach is about PH or PR roles.
IDK. I watched a coach get at least 15+ kids in a competitive varsity game (not including pitchers). It was a sight to be seen. Double pinch runners, Pinch hitters, you name it. Bottom line, every player was engaged because he never knew when his number would be called.
I think whether there will be anger depends on the coach. Most people are realistic. The kids definitely know who the players are and aren't. If the coach has a plan where the kids who play give the team the best chance to win, then most problems will be avoided. When the coach makes decisions where cause people to shake their heads is what causes problems. Like DH the senior who is like 0 for his entire 3 previous years. Or playing a kid in the infield because of his body style, not talent. Or not giving a kid the opportunity because he doesn't hit weak ground balls, but instead 25-30 deg. launch angle bombs which hit the "top of the net." When the losses pile up because of this type of BS, yes people get angry. Or overplaying your pitchers/outfielders so that by the end of they season they where out of gas - a day of rest after an outing never hurt anyone. Sum the season up in a first round playoff loss to a cross town team which you "should have beaten easily." oops.
Golfman makes a good point. HS rules (allowing starters to be pulled and return) do give an opportunity for role players. This year I believe we will have two fast kids -- the two fastest on the team in a 30 yard dash -- serve as pinch runners every game. They won't get many ABs (if any) but they will contribute to the team.
Golfman25 posted:adbono posted:Larger Varsity rosters seem to be the trend & I think it does nothing but cause problems. All 22 kids think they should be on the field regardless of their level of ability - and so do their parents. Last time I checked only 9 play at one time so there is no way to get every player involved no matter how creative Coach is about PH or PR roles.
IDK. I watched a coach get at least 15+ kids in a competitive varsity game (not including pitchers). It was a sight to be seen. Double pinch runners, Pinch hitters, you name it. Bottom line, every player was engaged because he never knew when his number would be called.
A coach that can (and will) do this is a rare exception. At least that has been my experience in the 6 years I have had a kid playing HS baseball.
Even rarer are parents of starters who understand and appreciate this kind of approach. Our guy does it and it makes me crazy. Last minute subs, kids already in the box getting pulled for a pinch hitter. All this in competitive games. Fine line between artistic and impulsive behavior.
Just as Ironhorse said this about putting together rosters...
"Don't underestimate the different layers that go into deciding on a varsity roster if you've never done it. It looks easy until you're make the decisions rather than suggestions."
... much of the same applies to in-game substitutions and PT. We usually have a pretty strong schedule so not to many blowouts. When we do, sometimes there can be a fine line between having a four or five run lead with your #3 pitcher and all of a sudden run ruling a team and having the game called short. Often, at various points in the game, things could have gone either way. If you pull the plug on starters early and it backfires on you, that's about the worst move you can make. People see a final score that implies a comfortable win and wonder why more guys didn't get in. They don't necessarily know how the game unfolded and what could have happened along the way.
For many of us, those multiple sub opportunities don't come that often. When they do come up, one could certainly argue that the program is better off giving those opportunities to the young players that will be contributors in the future and need game experience than to a senior who you know won't be. Still, there is sentimental pull.
Just a few of the MANY layers...
adbono posted:Golfman25 posted:...IDK. I watched a coach get at least 15+ kids in a competitive varsity game (not including pitchers). It was a sight to be seen. Double pinch runners, Pinch hitters, you name it. Bottom line, every player was engaged because he never knew when his number would be called.
A coach that can (and will) do this is a rare exception. At least that has been my experience in the 6 years I have had a kid playing HS baseball.
When's that kid gonna graduate already ? 
cabbagedad posted:adbono posted:Golfman25 posted:...IDK. I watched a coach get at least 15+ kids in a competitive varsity game (not including pitchers). It was a sight to be seen. Double pinch runners, Pinch hitters, you name it. Bottom line, every player was engaged because he never knew when his number would be called.
A coach that can (and will) do this is a rare exception. At least that has been my experience in the 6 years I have had a kid playing HS baseball.
When's that kid gonna graduate already ?
He is a little slow. Probably gonna go into coaching.
adbono posted:cabbagedad posted:adbono posted:Golfman25 posted:...IDK. I watched a coach get at least 15+ kids in a competitive varsity game (not including pitchers). It was a sight to be seen. Double pinch runners, Pinch hitters, you name it. Bottom line, every player was engaged because he never knew when his number would be called.
A coach that can (and will) do this is a rare exception. At least that has been my experience in the 6 years I have had a kid playing HS baseball.
When's that kid gonna graduate already ?
He is a little slow. Probably gonna go into coaching.
OK, that was good. I got nothin' Cuz, you know...
cabbagedad posted:adbono posted:cabbagedad posted:adbono posted:Golfman25 posted:...IDK. I watched a coach get at least 15+ kids in a competitive varsity game (not including pitchers). It was a sight to be seen. Double pinch runners, Pinch hitters, you name it. Bottom line, every player was engaged because he never knew when his number would be called.
A coach that can (and will) do this is a rare exception. At least that has been my experience in the 6 years I have had a kid playing HS baseball.
When's that kid gonna graduate already ?
He is a little slow. Probably gonna go into coaching.
OK, that was good. I got nothin' Cuz, you know...
cabbagedad posted:Just as Ironhorse said this about putting together rosters...
"Don't underestimate the different layers that go into deciding on a varsity roster if you've never done it. It looks easy until you're make the decisions rather than suggestions."
... much of the same applies to in-game substitutions and PT. We usually have a pretty strong schedule so not to many blowouts. When we do, sometimes there can be a fine line between having a four or five run lead with your #3 pitcher and all of a sudden run ruling a team and having the game called short. Often, at various points in the game, things could have gone either way. If you pull the plug on starters early and it backfires on you, that's about the worst move you can make. People see a final score that implies a comfortable win and wonder why more guys didn't get in. They don't necessarily know how the game unfolded and what could have happened along the way.
For many of us, those multiple sub opportunities don't come that often. When they do come up, one could certainly argue that the program is better off giving those opportunities to the young players that will be contributors in the future and need game experience than to a senior who you know won't be. Still, there is sentimental pull.
Just a few of the MANY layers...
Cabbage, do you have run rules? I thought you were CIF-SS? I know we don't have them (must play all 7 innings) . . . is it by league, rather than section?
ironhorse posted:I see all points, but let's settle down on acting like keeping a senior who won't play much is akin to rampant entitlement. This is HIGH SCHOOL baseball and for a lot of my kids this is the pinnacle of their athletic career. This generally impacts only 2 or 3 kids every couple of years.
If the pinnacle of the kids athletic career is riding the pine, do him a favor and cut him loose.
Consultant posted:Daily inter squad games use double DH, 6 outs per inning for the players to receive many AB's. If you are inside with batting tunnels have team pitchers [use pitching screen]; throw to a catcher and hitter. Grade the batted ball as out, hit, hit hard, pop up. When not hitting, play pepper with tennis balls.
Bob
Is that what you would want as a kid for your senior year HS baseball experience? “I played inter squad games.”
no thanks
Chicago643 posted:ironhorse posted:I see all points, but let's settle down on acting like keeping a senior who won't play much is akin to rampant entitlement. This is HIGH SCHOOL baseball and for a lot of my kids this is the pinnacle of their athletic career. This generally impacts only 2 or 3 kids every couple of years.
If the pinnacle of the kids athletic career is riding the pine, do him a favor and cut him loose.
Nah, if the coach has communicated his roll to him and he has accepted it, it's his choice. Gets to workout and be part of something. It's the coach's and the kid's call, not someone in the bleachers.
updated for gramma n spellin.
Son was on a team last year with 6 guys who were in a similar situation. 2 played significant time due to injuries of others, one spoke no English and couldn’t complain to anyone anyway, and 3 were cancers because they thought they should be starters. Reality is it is a rare player who is happy being on the bench, have seen it personally. Keep the roster lean, make it meaningful for those who are there to compete. If the kid is a great kid, he will find other pursuits.
rynoattack posted:ironhorse posted:We have too many seniors this year, but I've only cut 2 so far. They have till scrimmages end for the "final" cut. I likely won't cut anymore, though simply by talent I probably should.
To me the key to pulling it off is two-fold: solid communication of what their role will be and the ability to cut them mid-season if grumbling begins.
I plan on telling 3 kids that they will likely never cross the lines. They'll get a jersey during the season, but will likely give it up for the playoffs (they'll wear a BP top) so I can give it to a callup kid who might play. They are expected to be at every practice and workout and find a way to make a positive contribution on a regular basis. If they can't handle all of that they need to turn in their stuff.
These are good kids who have been with us for 4-years, they're good friends with the team and want to see their friends succeed, so I think we can pull it off.
I've been down the grumpy senior road in the past, and it can kill a team, but I may not have communicated as thoroughly as I am now.
If negativity begins to creep in, kids will be removed. No hesitation. And I'm getting much better at cutting kids their Junior year to avoid this circus.
I've always had a hard time understanding how a HS kid at the bottom of the roster would never receive playing time. Aren't there usually a few blow out games either way where you could throw the kid a bone?
To me, if the kid works hard and has a positive attitude, they should be rewarded in these types of situations.
Completely agree with the sentiment. A couple of our Seniors are PO kids who can't throw strikes, and flat can't hit. So even in a blowout it's tough. Kid threw 25 pitches tonight and 23 balls. Was progressing in the fall but regressing now. So what do you do? He's a good kid so I lean to keeping him around, but to each his own.
Chicago643 posted:ironhorse posted:I see all points, but let's settle down on acting like keeping a senior who won't play much is akin to rampant entitlement. This is HIGH SCHOOL baseball and for a lot of my kids this is the pinnacle of their athletic career. This generally impacts only 2 or 3 kids every couple of years.
If the pinnacle of the kids athletic career is riding the pine, do him a favor and cut him loose.
It all depends on perspective.
Not sure of your "pinnacle" from most of your posts, but you come off as either a potential big league hall of famer, or a guy who never played but wants to sound like a big league hall of famer. Probably not in between. But pretty sure you've never coached teenage kids that you cared about.
ironhorse posted:Chicago643 posted:ironhorse posted:I see all points, but let's settle down on acting like keeping a senior who won't play much is akin to rampant entitlement. This is HIGH SCHOOL baseball and for a lot of my kids this is the pinnacle of their athletic career. This generally impacts only 2 or 3 kids every couple of years.
If the pinnacle of the kids athletic career is riding the pine, do him a favor and cut him loose.
It all depends on perspective.
Not sure of your "pinnacle" from most of your posts, but you come off as either a potential big league hall of famer, or a guy who never played but wants to sound like a big league hall of famer. Probably not in between. But pretty sure you've never coached teenage kids that you cared about.
So, were you a bench warmer in high school baseball or a regular player? If you were a bench warmer, did you enjoy the experience for the sake of being on a team, or were you dying inside to be out there. You can justify “the team experience” angle all you want, I talk to enough players, parents and coaches to know the “cumbaya” feeling you think these kids are getting by gracing them with the opportunity to sit on your bench is not as miraculous as you think it is.
I never insinuated I was anything, other than opinionated. As a parent, I can honestly say I would rather a coach cut my kid if they were just keeping them on to be humane instead of stringing then along in the name of giving them something to hang their hats on, my kid will move on just fine, thank you.
Are you a parent? Because parenting a teenage kid is a whole lot like coaching one, except you have to deal with the fallout of having to explain why a coach strung you along. Being honest with a kid and letting them have the opportunity to try something else is not a bad thing, Ironhorse. You aren’t every kid’s savior there hot shot, so you can save the attitude. Had about enough of that.
Last year our team had a few seniors that had played JV as juniors and saw plenty of playing time, and had the choice to wear a varsity uniform and hardly ever play or stick with JV. They chose varsity. And I know at least one kids parents still came to almost every game. Mom brought her knitting. Not what I’d want for my kid if the situation was similar but I guess they had their reasons.
Chicago643 posted:ironhorse posted:Chicago643 posted:ironhorse posted:I see all points, but let's settle down on acting like keeping a senior who won't play much is akin to rampant entitlement. This is HIGH SCHOOL baseball and for a lot of my kids this is the pinnacle of their athletic career. This generally impacts only 2 or 3 kids every couple of years.
If the pinnacle of the kids athletic career is riding the pine, do him a favor and cut him loose.
It all depends on perspective.
Not sure of your "pinnacle" from most of your posts, but you come off as either a potential big league hall of famer, or a guy who never played but wants to sound like a big league hall of famer. Probably not in between. But pretty sure you've never coached teenage kids that you cared about.
So, were you a bench warmer in high school baseball or a regular player? If you were a bench warmer, did you enjoy the experience for the sake of being on a team, or were you dying inside to be out there. You can justify “the team experience” angle all you want, I talk to enough players, parents and coaches to know the “cumbaya” feeling you think these kids are getting by gracing them with the opportunity to sit on your bench is not as miraculous as you think it is.
I never insinuated I was anything, other than opinionated. As a parent, I can honestly say I would rather a coach cut my kid if they were just keeping them on to be humane instead of stringing then along in the name of giving them something to hang their hats on, my kid will move on just fine, thank you.
Are you a parent? Because parenting a teenage kid is a whole lot like coaching one, except you have to deal with the fallout of having to explain why a coach strung you along. Being honest with a kid and letting them have the opportunity to try something else is not a bad thing, Ironhorse. You aren’t every kid’s savior there hot shot, so you can save the attitude. Had about enough of that.
A. It's Kumbaya
B. It doesn't matter what you would prefer the coach to do. It's your kids baseball career.
C. Good communication = not "stringing kids along" I said this a million times now.
Not trying to be a savior, simply communicating honestly with kids and giving them an opportunity to choose their path. Not basing it on what their dad would prefer.
I'm sorry you've had enough of my honesty and good communication. I'll stop that.
If it was just about the innings played it would only be worth it to 10 or 12 guys right? Would it even be worth it if your team was not very good? If this whole thing is about how much you play why would you have more than 11 or 12 players ever?
Why do coaches invest in players that will never contribute on the field in games or play meaningful innings? Why do coaches spend hours upon hours working with kids that will more than likely never contribute? Why not just work with the one's that you see potential in?
Why would anyone ever want their kid to be on a team when they were not going to be a starter and or get playing time? What a waste of time.
Could it be that the baseball is only a fraction of what is important? Could it be the baseball is used to teach things much more important than a game? Could it be that the baseball gets them together but something else keeps them together, for life? Could it be the baseball is important now but pales in comparison to what is learned through the game? Will anyone care what your batting average was or wasn't 20 years from now? Will it matter if you learned how to be on time, what true commitment is, the value of team work, discipline, sacrifice?
You want to know what my former players talk about when they get together? They rarely talk about the games won, the big hit, the great play, who were the studs. They talk about that time Jimmy ate 4 Whopper's after a game. They talk about the time they had to run for playing around at the cage and how they almost passed out. They talk about the bus rides, the talk about the investment it took to be on the team, they talk about the pride in being a part of something bigger than them. No one cares what your batting average was. No one cares how many innings you played. Do you value one child over the other because one has more talent? Do you value one sibling over the other because one had more talent?
Why do I keep players that will rarely contribute or never contribute? Why do I want to keep more kids than I actually need to round out a team? Because I want as many kids as possible to experience the experience. I want as many kids as possible to get things much more important than baseball. It doesn't hurt my feelings that kids won't get to start or experience being good players. It hurts my feelings to know they won't be part of something they can carry with them long after the baseball has ended.
The most important thing about playing on a team is not what goes on during the 2 or 3 hours of a game. The most important thing about playing on a team is being on a team. The most important things your son will learn from playing on a team will never show up in a box score. If it was just about who could play and who couldn't play it wouldn't be worth what I invest. It's much more important and valuable than that.
Honest open communication. Teaching young men it's bigger than you. It's not about me its about we. If you have to be a starter or a major contributor to realize the value to being a member of a team then you have no team. You have a group of individuals calling themselves a team. If every member of the team understands their role and works to bring value and expand that role for the good of the whole you have a team.
As a parent what do I value the most from my son's athletic experience? Is it the accomplishments on the field? Is it the awards and trophies? Is it the notoriety they gained? Or is it those things that helped them become the men they are today? The things that they learned through the game, the struggles, tough times, life lessons, perseverance, team work, dedication, determination, work ethic, grinditthefout never give up trust in yourself toughness, respect for those guys that lay it on the line just like you, fight for it, life isn't fair but that's ok, keep on grinding, pick him up, pick yourself up, treat others the way you would want to be treated, humility, sacrifice, it's bigger than you, be that guy, don't be that guy, if it was easy everyone would do it, your feelings are not fact's deal with the truth, excuses never solved a problem, on and on it goes. All of that can be learned and much more even if you never get off the bench in a game.
Sometimes the greatest experience you can give someone is viewed by others as a total failure. Tell them to stop reading the box scores and just watch my life.
Yeah. What the said.
Not to change the subject, which Coach May nailed with his typically wonderful insights, but when I read his last sentence the first time, I thought he wrote “stop reading the box scores and just watch my WIFE.”
ironhorse posted:Chicago643 posted:ironhorse posted:Chicago643 posted:ironhorse posted:I see all points, but let's settle down on acting like keeping a senior who won't play much is akin to rampant entitlement. This is HIGH SCHOOL baseball and for a lot of my kids this is the pinnacle of their athletic career. This generally impacts only 2 or 3 kids every couple of years.
If the pinnacle of the kids athletic career is riding the pine, do him a favor and cut him loose.
It all depends on perspective.
Not sure of your "pinnacle" from most of your posts, but you come off as either a potential big league hall of famer, or a guy who never played but wants to sound like a big league hall of famer. Probably not in between. But pretty sure you've never coached teenage kids that you cared about.
So, were you a bench warmer in high school baseball or a regular player? If you were a bench warmer, did you enjoy the experience for the sake of being on a team, or were you dying inside to be out there. You can justify “the team experience” angle all you want, I talk to enough players, parents and coaches to know the “cumbaya” feeling you think these kids are getting by gracing them with the opportunity to sit on your bench is not as miraculous as you think it is.
I never insinuated I was anything, other than opinionated. As a parent, I can honestly say I would rather a coach cut my kid if they were just keeping them on to be humane instead of stringing then along in the name of giving them something to hang their hats on, my kid will move on just fine, thank you.
Are you a parent? Because parenting a teenage kid is a whole lot like coaching one, except you have to deal with the fallout of having to explain why a coach strung you along. Being honest with a kid and letting them have the opportunity to try something else is not a bad thing, Ironhorse. You aren’t every kid’s savior there hot shot, so you can save the attitude. Had about enough of that.
A. It's Kumbaya
B. It doesn't matter what you would prefer the coach to do. It's your kids baseball career.
C. Good communication = not "stringing kids along" I said this a million times now.
Not trying to be a savior, simply communicating honestly with kids and giving them an opportunity to choose their path. Not basing it on what their dad would prefer.
I'm sorry you've had enough of my honesty and good communication. I'll stop that.
If you already have all the answers as a coach, why are you posing questions like “what do you want to hear in a parent meeting?” You apparently already know w what is best for everyone. Assuming to are between 24-30, don’t have kids and feel pretty cocky that you may have played college ball at some level and now have the opportunity to “develop” citizens....newsflash, nobody is paying you to develop well rounded people, Ironhorse.
Chicago643 posted:If you already have all the answers as a coach, why are you posing questions like “what do you want to hear in a parent meeting?” You apparently already know w what is best for everyone. Assuming to are between 24-30, don’t have kids and feel pretty cocky that you may have played college ball at some level and now have the opportunity to “develop” citizens....newsflash, nobody is paying you to develop well rounded people, Ironhorse.
You literally guessed wrong on every aspect of my life above. That's fun.
And I asked the question because I know I don't have all the answers. I've never sat on the other side as a parent and was interested in trying to learn more about that perspective. I've been doing this a while now, but I don't want to stop learning how to do things better. I think I improved our parent meeting this year, so I'm proud of that.
And they may not be paying me to "develop well rounded people" in your eyes, but that doesn't mean I'm not going to try. I'm pretty proud of the way we develop quality citizens, but a guy like you will never get that, so why waste my time?
