http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RD0Vvk7jQT8
http://www.advarsitysports.com...-3513-yuba-high.html
http://blogs.sacbee.com/preps/...brawl-halts-jun.html
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This is so sad. All of this horrible behavior occurred at a baseball game, not because of a baseball game.
From the Sacremento Bee article...
I'll bet Coach Stassi and I have one thing in common after viewing and reading about this unfortunate event...a tear running down our cheek.
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This is so sad. All of this horrible behavior occurred at a baseball game, not because of a baseball game.
From the Sacremento Bee article...
- The Yuba City varsity won four consecutive Sac-Joaquin Section Division III baseball championships in going 116-9 from 2007-2010 under famed coach Jim Stassi, who retired following the 2010 season with a sparkling reputation as a coach and sportsman.
I'll bet Coach Stassi and I have one thing in common after viewing and reading about this unfortunate event...a tear running down our cheek.
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From what I've seen and read, it's the first base coach who should be the primary target of any disciplinary action. For an adult to incite such rage in a young person to even think about throwing a baseball at him is telling of someone who doesn't belong working with young athletes. While the Honkers players and parents are the ones that look bad on the video you have to wonder what all the background is that prompted this melee. It's obvious the mom's (while inappropriate) have had a belly full of something. (Pun intended)
Possibly her husband? 
quote:From what I've seen and read, it's the first base coach who should be the primary target of any disciplinary action.
I'd be interested to see what you've read... There is zero excuse for those players going off like that.
quote:I'd be interested to see what you've read... There is zero excuse for those players going off like that.
Please don't get me wrong... I agree with you 95%. I would say there is 5% excuse for the benches to clear and that just reinforces what I said, how bad it must have been to incite that response. There are some things worth fighting for. I.e. your mothers honor (may or may not be the case here).
Diplomacy before action.
quote:Originally posted by Bulldog 19:quote:From what I've seen and read, it's the first base coach who should be the primary target of any disciplinary action.
I'd be interested to see what you've read... There is zero excuse for those players going off like that.
The two AD's should get together, view the video tape, determine which players are suspended for the rest of the year. Then, then the remaining players from both teams should be combined and "forced" to play as a team for the rest of the schedule.
I guarantee that if I were either of the head coaches in that scenario I would have had my players under control and headed back to the dugout within 15 secs.
Though my players wouldn't have rushed the field in the first place.
This brawl isn't tragic. Nobody got knifed.
But it's absolutely pathetic that coaches were unable to control their players.
I'm disgusted that a grown adult male can't command 15 year olds.
Though my players wouldn't have rushed the field in the first place.
This brawl isn't tragic. Nobody got knifed.
But it's absolutely pathetic that coaches were unable to control their players.
I'm disgusted that a grown adult male can't command 15 year olds.
That's crazy... You could be right that the 1B Coach MAY have said something that pushed the kid over the edge (or maybe he was just saying something the kid just didn't like?), the kid left reality when he fired a ball at the coach, and then ran over and attacked/tried to attack the coach... Regardless of anything the coach may have or may have not said, the kid should have NEVER done what he did...quote:Originally posted by mcmmccm:
From what I've seen and read, it's the first base coach who should be the primary target of any disciplinary action. For an adult to incite such rage in a young person to even think about throwing a baseball at him is telling of someone who doesn't belong working with young athletes.
quote:Originally posted by mcmmccm:
From what I've seen and read, it's the first base coach who should be the primary target of any disciplinary action. For an adult to incite such rage in a young person to even think about throwing a baseball at him is telling of someone who doesn't belong working with young athletes.
If what the Coach said was so bad I'm sure one of the Ump's would have got involved. There is no case where you could justify to me that a High School player could throw a ball at an Adult Coach & then attack him. He should be Banned from playing School Ball Just as a Parent or Coach would be banned if they acted the same way.
I don't think I ever said anything about giving the player a pass. My point was directed at the coach who was laughing about the incident he played such a major role in creating.
I'm a parent at that game. And yes, for Yuba City. This whole thing is ugly and I do not condone what our pitcher or some of our boys did. But you have to understand, there was a lot said that you haven't heard and there is a lot being done out of sight of the camera. I again, do not condone what he did but the coaches and the one ump at this game need to be truthful in their part of this story. The coaches for the opposing team were way out of line and what that coach said to our pitcher's mother, out loud, is what set our guy off. Way, way out of line.
You also have to know that the majority of our team is now being severely punished. Many, and I'm not talking about the obvious ones, but some that were just there are being removed from the team. We will be lucky to have an infield when all is said and done. The administration and coaches are receiving such heat that they are making harsh punishments that will be affecting the future of many of our players.
You also don't see in the video, the opposing parents actually being involved and kicking and kneeing some of our players. They should have legal action in my opnion.
Again, I don't think our pitcher was right. And I am saddened by the cheap shots I see. But please remember, there is more to this than what you see, and these kids were doing what they thought was right. There pitcher was swarmed and being hit by the opposing team. What would you do? Leave him there by himself, or go to his aid? I know I have taught my boys to help someone in need of help. I am proud of my son out there.
You also have to know that the majority of our team is now being severely punished. Many, and I'm not talking about the obvious ones, but some that were just there are being removed from the team. We will be lucky to have an infield when all is said and done. The administration and coaches are receiving such heat that they are making harsh punishments that will be affecting the future of many of our players.
You also don't see in the video, the opposing parents actually being involved and kicking and kneeing some of our players. They should have legal action in my opnion.
Again, I don't think our pitcher was right. And I am saddened by the cheap shots I see. But please remember, there is more to this than what you see, and these kids were doing what they thought was right. There pitcher was swarmed and being hit by the opposing team. What would you do? Leave him there by himself, or go to his aid? I know I have taught my boys to help someone in need of help. I am proud of my son out there.
quote:I'm a parent at that game. And yes, for Yuba City. This whole thing is ugly and I do not condone what our pitcher or some of our boys did. But you have to understand, there was a lot said that you haven't heard and there is a lot being done out of sight of the camera. I again, do not condone what he did but the coaches and the one ump at this game need to be truthful in their part of this story. The coaches for the opposing team were way out of line and what that coach said to our pitcher's mother, out loud, is what set our guy off. Way, way out of line.
You also have to know that the majority of our team is now being severely punished. Many, and I'm not talking about the obvious ones, but some that were just there are being removed from the team. We will be lucky to have an infield when all is said and done. The administration and coaches are receiving such heat that they are making harsh punishments that will be affecting the future of many of our players.
You also don't see in the video, the opposing parents actually being involved and kicking and kneeing some of our players. They should have legal action in my opnion.
Again, I don't think our pitcher was right. And I am saddened by the cheap shots I see. But please remember, there is more to this than what you see, and these kids were doing what they thought was right. There pitcher was swarmed and being hit by the opposing team. What would you do? Leave him there by himself, or go to his aid? I know I have taught my boys to help someone in need of help. I am proud of my son out there.
I don't think I ever said anything about giving the player a pass. My point was directed at the coach who was laughing about the incident he played such a major role in creating.
I never said you wanted to give the Player a pass, My point is no matter what the other Coach was saying & to whom he was saying it There is NO excuse for the player to Throw the Ball or attack the Coach
I can't imagine their is a legitimate excuse for the pitcher to throw the ball at the coach. I get the image of an out of control kid who lost his cool under pressure. Either because of the game situation or the trash talking.
I can understand a "shut the ____ up coach" if the coach was taunting him. But other than that it sounds like the kid lost it.
And whoever was throwing those punches at the player/coach on the ground was an angry dude. I bet he is a better fighter than baseball player.
I can understand a "shut the ____ up coach" if the coach was taunting him. But other than that it sounds like the kid lost it.
And whoever was throwing those punches at the player/coach on the ground was an angry dude. I bet he is a better fighter than baseball player.
quote:Originally posted by BBfam:
The administration and coaches are receiving such heat that they are making harsh punishments that will be affecting the future of many of our players.
It isn't the harsh punishments that will be affecting the future of many of your players...it's the actions of the players that caused the harsh punishments.
quote:what that coach said to our pitcher's mother, out loud, is what set our guy off.
OK, I would have climbed over the fence on that one. Good for the pitcher to stand up for his Mom. The Del Campo coach should be fired.
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There always is at least two sides to a story. Thank you BBfam for your first hand report. I feel sorry for your son and others who may very well be slapped with a severe penalty for little or minor participation in this horrible display.
It was the actions of the adults that troubled me the most. These adults should be leading the players down the right path in life...certainly not in the direction caught by the camera. Many, many wrong decisions were made in a very short time.
The Sacramento Bee mentioned Coach Stassi. An outstanding coach it appears. I truly shed a tear when I saw the actions of the adults. Coach Stassi likely did too. A real sad situation.
The camera obviously did not catch the entire sequence of events or the intensity. The tension was simmering I'm sure. Violence doesn't escalate that quickly.
It is my opinion this ugly episode, that just happened to occur on a baseball field, was the result of lots and lots of unresolved issues in the lives of the participants. The game was merely a catalyst to draw out this violent and disgusting behavior.
For all of the people who were wrong, and you know who you are, you had better look in the mirror and tell that reflection that you're willing to own up to your intolerable behavior. Don't deny, don't be lazy, dig deep for answers.
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- "...there is more to this than what you see..."
There always is at least two sides to a story. Thank you BBfam for your first hand report. I feel sorry for your son and others who may very well be slapped with a severe penalty for little or minor participation in this horrible display.
It was the actions of the adults that troubled me the most. These adults should be leading the players down the right path in life...certainly not in the direction caught by the camera. Many, many wrong decisions were made in a very short time.
The Sacramento Bee mentioned Coach Stassi. An outstanding coach it appears. I truly shed a tear when I saw the actions of the adults. Coach Stassi likely did too. A real sad situation.
The camera obviously did not catch the entire sequence of events or the intensity. The tension was simmering I'm sure. Violence doesn't escalate that quickly.
It is my opinion this ugly episode, that just happened to occur on a baseball field, was the result of lots and lots of unresolved issues in the lives of the participants. The game was merely a catalyst to draw out this violent and disgusting behavior.
For all of the people who were wrong, and you know who you are, you had better look in the mirror and tell that reflection that you're willing to own up to your intolerable behavior. Don't deny, don't be lazy, dig deep for answers.
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quote:OK, I would have climbed over the fence on that one. Good for the pitcher to stand up for his Mom. The coach should be fired.
We dont know what was said or what Mom said to the Coach. I will state again there is nothing that would justify throwing at & then attacking an adult Coach.Fillsfan hit it on the head, Out of Control kid. He has now ruined the season for a whole School
Just to see the other side of this...
What is the pitcher supposed to do while he is out on the field with his Mom being humiliated by this grown man? (Coaches tell their batters to let the ball hit them, so it can't hurt, right?)
This coach incited a riot with his actions.
It looks like Del Campo will win the media war, since they got out front and set the headlines in their favor. "Yuba City High JV baseball involved in brawl" Imagine if the headline was "Del Campo coach insults single Mom, hits player"
/ I don't know either team, so I don't have a dog in this fight.
quote:Originally posted by CBMDad:
there is nothing that would justify throwing at & then attacking an adult Coach.
What is the pitcher supposed to do while he is out on the field with his Mom being humiliated by this grown man? (Coaches tell their batters to let the ball hit them, so it can't hurt, right?)
This coach incited a riot with his actions.
It looks like Del Campo will win the media war, since they got out front and set the headlines in their favor. "Yuba City High JV baseball involved in brawl" Imagine if the headline was "Del Campo coach insults single Mom, hits player"
/ I don't know either team, so I don't have a dog in this fight.
quote:What is the pitcher supposed to do while he is out on the field with his Mom being humiliated by this grown man?
Assault with a deadly weapon? Good decision....
Does anyone know what the mother said to the coach, if anything, to elicit the remark from the coach.
I'm sure there are a few people, on field and off, that had some responsibility for this incident to explode into that nightmare.
I'm sure there are a few people, on field and off, that had some responsibility for this incident to explode into that nightmare.
What they really need here is a six-pack summit. Why not just get all these people together and let everyone own up to their part, apologize, share a group hug and move on. Nobody got hurt here. Make it learning experience about responsibility, reconciliation and respect. Isn't that what we need more of? Schoolyard scraps used to make the best of friends with a new found respect for one another.
The one thing I told my boys I would back them 100% on would be defending their Mother's honor. If you can't fight for that,j there's nothing worth fighting for. I've heard it said if there's nothing worth fighting for than there's nothing worth living for.
No I don't have a rebel flag hanging in my garage.
The one thing I told my boys I would back them 100% on would be defending their Mother's honor. If you can't fight for that,j there's nothing worth fighting for. I've heard it said if there's nothing worth fighting for than there's nothing worth living for.
No I don't have a rebel flag hanging in my garage.
quote:Originally posted by SultanofSwat:
What is the pitcher supposed to do while he is out on the field with his Mom being humiliated by this grown man?
In this case an old saying comes to mind
"Sticks and stones may break my bones but words shall never harm"
Should the kid be upset over the coach insulting his mom??? You better believe it - lash out like this?????? NEVER - this comes down to impulse control and it's something he better learn before he enters the real world.
There were people in place that should have handled it when the coach started talking trash. The ump should have ejected him on the spot. Since he was in the first base box I'm assuming he was the asst. then his head coach should have told him to shut up. The pitchers head coach should have stopped the game and made the ump aware / do something about this.
If any of these actions would have happened the chance of a brawl goes down.
Just because you don't fight a person who insults your mom doesn't mean you don't respect / love her. We all have roles and responsibilities in society and we need to let those people take care of business. If they don't then go over their heads so they can find someone who will.
No excuse for the coach talking trash
No excuse for the pitcher to throw / charge the coach
No excuse for the ump to not maintain better control of the game
No excuse for a lot of things that went on here.
People need to learn from this situation.
Was the coach talking trash at the mom BEFORE the incident???
That is reeedick-u-lous if true...
That is reeedick-u-lous if true...
First of all I do not condone any type of violence at all especially on a baseball field. Second, if you are going to be a pitcher you better have really thick skin, because as you get older and get the chance to continue to play the mouthing off only gets worse. They are trying to get you off your game. I have been there, you need to turn off the "Rabbit Ears".
Again, I DO NOT agree with what our pitcher did (and some of the other players). He has been justly punished. BUT, you really have to ask yourself why did he snap. The mother did nothing wrong. It was not the verbal mother you see in the video. The pitcher's mom actually handled it very well. I will say that prior to the incident, neither side of parents were really doing much. Typical stuff but nothing out of line for either side.
If we are honest, and you can ask yourselves and your sons, if this incident happened at their game, what would you do? I believe most of you would be out there trying to help. We've all seen the brawls on TV. The majority of kids are trying to do the right thing, my son included. He is trying to keep people back and stop the fight. Problem is fists fly in a fight. I know my kid got hit. I'm not mad about that. You don't see off screen the other team just as involved as us.
Problem is that most of our boys are receiving severe punishment. Their boys, nothing as far as I've heard. I don't think the opposing dugout deserves severe punishment, but I also don't think most of our team does either. Some do, yes. Most don't imho.
And please remember, the pitcher didn't just decide, "hey, I think I will go hurt that coach over there". He definitely was provoked. By an adult, who is seen saying, " I don't know what happened." Then laughing. He needs to man up and take responsibility for his actions as well as the 3rd base coach and umpire.
The sad thing is that Yuba City has been and is a top notch program with top notch kids and coaches. This is a sad day. My varsity son is sick to death about it. People who have seen us or played us will say the same thing. I'm not so sure the same thing will be said about the other program. I don't blame their kids, I put a lot of blame on the staff. And my hope is that the adult parties do the right thing for all kids involved.
If we are honest, and you can ask yourselves and your sons, if this incident happened at their game, what would you do? I believe most of you would be out there trying to help. We've all seen the brawls on TV. The majority of kids are trying to do the right thing, my son included. He is trying to keep people back and stop the fight. Problem is fists fly in a fight. I know my kid got hit. I'm not mad about that. You don't see off screen the other team just as involved as us.
Problem is that most of our boys are receiving severe punishment. Their boys, nothing as far as I've heard. I don't think the opposing dugout deserves severe punishment, but I also don't think most of our team does either. Some do, yes. Most don't imho.
And please remember, the pitcher didn't just decide, "hey, I think I will go hurt that coach over there". He definitely was provoked. By an adult, who is seen saying, " I don't know what happened." Then laughing. He needs to man up and take responsibility for his actions as well as the 3rd base coach and umpire.
The sad thing is that Yuba City has been and is a top notch program with top notch kids and coaches. This is a sad day. My varsity son is sick to death about it. People who have seen us or played us will say the same thing. I'm not so sure the same thing will be said about the other program. I don't blame their kids, I put a lot of blame on the staff. And my hope is that the adult parties do the right thing for all kids involved.
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Again, thanks for your report.
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Again, thanks for your report.
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First of all, Hello old friends (that's you too GW), haven't been on for a while but I do feel the need to comment on this one.
I was not at this game. I have not spoken to anyone that was at this game, so what I have to say is just based on personal experience over the years. Having said that, here goes.
I have never, ever in all my years of having the priviledge of attending and enjoying the great game of baseball heard anyone speak about anyone's mother. Oh, I take that back....plenty of times there were comments like " tell your MOM thanks for the cupcakes ", or " your MOM brings the best snacks ". Seriously,
a grown man/coach is allegedly commenting on a player's mother???? Weird.
During my sons high school years, one of the things that everyone looked forward to is our non-league game with Yuba City. The guys would get out of school even earlier than usual for the just over hour long bus ride to YC. The varsity field was really fun to play on. The field was well maintained, the atmosphere on a Friday night for a high school baseball game was exciting and fun for all. But most of all, the Honkers were respectful, gracious and welcoming. Our coach had maintained a long friendship with the varsity head coach at Yuba. They had a great mutual respect for each other. Both teams always looked forward to a highly competitive contest. Yet, the very best part of the time spent at that field over the years aside from the game itself was the incredible atmosphere at the game. The Yuba fans really support their baseball. The games would be on the local radio, the announcer at the game was fantastic, getting everyone's name right calling the plays with great enthusiasim and accuracy all while plugging the local sponsors and advertisers. The aroma of BBQ floating through the air, snack bar packed with everyone's favorites and the stands so full, chairs were in order for those who arrived late (meaning less than an hour early). Yep, those fans would compliment our team on a nice hit or play and at the end of the game we'd all stand around the bleachers and win or lose, chat it up, not wanting to leave this perfect slice of Americana - a small town with a huge heart for baseball. This is what I know of Yuba City baseball. Some of our best baseball memories.
Now, I know that this particular game was not in Yuba City, it was at Granite Bay High School, a site known for hosting pre-seaon round robin tourneys and Spring tournaments, always well run from what we experienced. I truly wish that the umpire, head coach, or another assistant would have intervened before emotions got tight and the benches cleared.
I was not at this game. I have not spoken to anyone that was at this game, so what I have to say is just based on personal experience over the years. Having said that, here goes.
I have never, ever in all my years of having the priviledge of attending and enjoying the great game of baseball heard anyone speak about anyone's mother. Oh, I take that back....plenty of times there were comments like " tell your MOM thanks for the cupcakes ", or " your MOM brings the best snacks ". Seriously,
a grown man/coach is allegedly commenting on a player's mother???? Weird.
During my sons high school years, one of the things that everyone looked forward to is our non-league game with Yuba City. The guys would get out of school even earlier than usual for the just over hour long bus ride to YC. The varsity field was really fun to play on. The field was well maintained, the atmosphere on a Friday night for a high school baseball game was exciting and fun for all. But most of all, the Honkers were respectful, gracious and welcoming. Our coach had maintained a long friendship with the varsity head coach at Yuba. They had a great mutual respect for each other. Both teams always looked forward to a highly competitive contest. Yet, the very best part of the time spent at that field over the years aside from the game itself was the incredible atmosphere at the game. The Yuba fans really support their baseball. The games would be on the local radio, the announcer at the game was fantastic, getting everyone's name right calling the plays with great enthusiasim and accuracy all while plugging the local sponsors and advertisers. The aroma of BBQ floating through the air, snack bar packed with everyone's favorites and the stands so full, chairs were in order for those who arrived late (meaning less than an hour early). Yep, those fans would compliment our team on a nice hit or play and at the end of the game we'd all stand around the bleachers and win or lose, chat it up, not wanting to leave this perfect slice of Americana - a small town with a huge heart for baseball. This is what I know of Yuba City baseball. Some of our best baseball memories.
Now, I know that this particular game was not in Yuba City, it was at Granite Bay High School, a site known for hosting pre-seaon round robin tourneys and Spring tournaments, always well run from what we experienced. I truly wish that the umpire, head coach, or another assistant would have intervened before emotions got tight and the benches cleared.
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What a difference a good coach makes!
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What a difference a good coach makes!
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Everyone, everywhere, needs to get back there...it's an irresistable place. Who would not want to be there? The trouble is that some have never been there, they don't know it exists. It's where we should be.
Baseball is a great game if we allow it to be. It should come easily. Thanks for the memory and the hope iheartbb. Don't be scarce...'we heart iheartbb'.
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- "...not wanting to leave this perfect slice of Americana..."
Everyone, everywhere, needs to get back there...it's an irresistable place. Who would not want to be there? The trouble is that some have never been there, they don't know it exists. It's where we should be.
Baseball is a great game if we allow it to be. It should come easily. Thanks for the memory and the hope iheartbb. Don't be scarce...'we heart iheartbb'.
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quote:Problem is that most of our boys are receiving severe punishment.
Unfortunately rules are pretty simple. The moment a kid leaves the dugout or his position when a fight breaks out, it's automatic for most high school games..
[quote]What is the pitcher supposed to do while he is out on the field with his Mom being humiliated by this grown man? (Coaches tell their batters to let the ball hit them, so it can't hurt, right?)[/quote
I cant tell if this is sarcastic or not. I dont think it is & I'm having a hard time beleiving it.
I cant tell if this is sarcastic or not. I dont think it is & I'm having a hard time beleiving it.
I was umpiring at another high school nearby (Del Campo, one of the schools involved) when this happened. I heard about it the next day from the Del Campo coaches, as I was umpiring there again for the freshman Easter tournament, and as might be expected it sounded a bit one sided based on their explanation. Based on talking to a number of people around the periphery, namely coaches at several schools who have direct knowledge of what happened, it's apparent that there is plenty of blame to go around to everyone.
First, the parents of Yuba City, at least a few of them, seem to have precipitated this with some extended verbal taunting from the stands. From what I've been told by coaches, their actions probably are what caused this to happen, for if they'd have been more disciplined, the others wouldn't have had a reason to get in the gutter like they did. Second, the Del Campo coach for responding with "Someone tell that B**ch to shut up" (That's what I've been told he said, and she happened to be the pitcher's mom.) and most of all to the Yuba City pitcher for conduct that is absolutely unacceptable under any circumstance. Also, it is apparent that the umpire may have let this situation get too far out of hand, instead of putting his foot down and putting a stop to the trash talking on everyone's part before it got to the boiling point.
The umpire possibly had several remedies at his disposal before the fight erupted. He could have warned the coach and restricted him to his bench. He also could have removed the parent from the stands or held up the game until she left. He certainly could have warned, or ejected, the pitcher if he did anything prior to throwing the ball at the coach and then attacking him.
From my perspective, both as an umpire but also as a coach who coaches players at this age level (and, yes, I've coached players from both of these schools in past years, though none of those involved. I've also umpired games at all levels for both of these schools) the part that is totally, 100% unacceptable and indefensible, is the pitcher throwing at the first base coach and then he and the catcher both attacking the coach. I've been told that the pitcher and catcher initiated a 'chop block' as is done in football, where the catcher hit the coach low and the pitcher hit him high. After that happened, you can see most of the rest on Youtube. No matter what led up to the pitcher throwing at the coach, there is absolutely NOTHING to justify or excuse his actions from the point of throwing the ball, onward. While the coach may have been way out of line for his verbal outburst, he certainly was in the right to defend himself after being attacked by more than one teenaged player. These kids are big, and strong, and can seriously injure an adult. If I were in the position of being attacked, I'd certainly defend myself appropriately.
My understanding is that Yuba City has not only suspended the entire team for a week, which is relatively minor considering that the team only had tournament games on Tuesday and Wednesday and they're all out for Easter vacation this week; but that six YC players have been kicked off the team and the pitcher may be, or has been, expelled from school. Given the gravity of what he did, that does not seem inappropriate, no matter how provoked he may have felt. There are certain lines you NEVER cross under any circumstance, and throwing at and attacking a coach is one of those lines. If he in fact did those things, he should never be allowed to play high school sports again, anywhere. PERIOD. I don't know what discipline the catcher has received, but believe that his punishment should be only slightly less than the pitcher's, given how they coordinated their attack on the coach. Perhaps his punishment should match that of the pitcher, maybe not, time will tell.
With regard to all the players ejected, understand that it is a CIF (California Interscholastic Federation) rule that any player leaving the bench during an on-field dispute shall be automatically ejected, regardless of his motive or actions. Leaving the dugout to go to this brawl was an automatic ejection and suspension for every single player who did so. It is a 'black and white' rule with no need for discretion or interpretation on the part of the umpire.
One thing is certain, a lot of people contributed to this mess in different ways. If any of them had acted differently than they did at the time, perhaps the entire thing never would have happened. Both programs have long, proud baseball traditions, and this incident marks a low point in each program. They'll both recover from it, but need to take strong action to deal with the problem. The comments by iheartbb, above in this thread, are 100% spot on about Yuba City. They have a great baseball tradition, and Del Campo does as well, though not of the same level. Granite Bay does an outstanding job of running tournaments, and their coaches did a great job of breaking up the fight and then controlling this mess once they got onto the field.
First, the parents of Yuba City, at least a few of them, seem to have precipitated this with some extended verbal taunting from the stands. From what I've been told by coaches, their actions probably are what caused this to happen, for if they'd have been more disciplined, the others wouldn't have had a reason to get in the gutter like they did. Second, the Del Campo coach for responding with "Someone tell that B**ch to shut up" (That's what I've been told he said, and she happened to be the pitcher's mom.) and most of all to the Yuba City pitcher for conduct that is absolutely unacceptable under any circumstance. Also, it is apparent that the umpire may have let this situation get too far out of hand, instead of putting his foot down and putting a stop to the trash talking on everyone's part before it got to the boiling point.
The umpire possibly had several remedies at his disposal before the fight erupted. He could have warned the coach and restricted him to his bench. He also could have removed the parent from the stands or held up the game until she left. He certainly could have warned, or ejected, the pitcher if he did anything prior to throwing the ball at the coach and then attacking him.
From my perspective, both as an umpire but also as a coach who coaches players at this age level (and, yes, I've coached players from both of these schools in past years, though none of those involved. I've also umpired games at all levels for both of these schools) the part that is totally, 100% unacceptable and indefensible, is the pitcher throwing at the first base coach and then he and the catcher both attacking the coach. I've been told that the pitcher and catcher initiated a 'chop block' as is done in football, where the catcher hit the coach low and the pitcher hit him high. After that happened, you can see most of the rest on Youtube. No matter what led up to the pitcher throwing at the coach, there is absolutely NOTHING to justify or excuse his actions from the point of throwing the ball, onward. While the coach may have been way out of line for his verbal outburst, he certainly was in the right to defend himself after being attacked by more than one teenaged player. These kids are big, and strong, and can seriously injure an adult. If I were in the position of being attacked, I'd certainly defend myself appropriately.
My understanding is that Yuba City has not only suspended the entire team for a week, which is relatively minor considering that the team only had tournament games on Tuesday and Wednesday and they're all out for Easter vacation this week; but that six YC players have been kicked off the team and the pitcher may be, or has been, expelled from school. Given the gravity of what he did, that does not seem inappropriate, no matter how provoked he may have felt. There are certain lines you NEVER cross under any circumstance, and throwing at and attacking a coach is one of those lines. If he in fact did those things, he should never be allowed to play high school sports again, anywhere. PERIOD. I don't know what discipline the catcher has received, but believe that his punishment should be only slightly less than the pitcher's, given how they coordinated their attack on the coach. Perhaps his punishment should match that of the pitcher, maybe not, time will tell.
With regard to all the players ejected, understand that it is a CIF (California Interscholastic Federation) rule that any player leaving the bench during an on-field dispute shall be automatically ejected, regardless of his motive or actions. Leaving the dugout to go to this brawl was an automatic ejection and suspension for every single player who did so. It is a 'black and white' rule with no need for discretion or interpretation on the part of the umpire.
One thing is certain, a lot of people contributed to this mess in different ways. If any of them had acted differently than they did at the time, perhaps the entire thing never would have happened. Both programs have long, proud baseball traditions, and this incident marks a low point in each program. They'll both recover from it, but need to take strong action to deal with the problem. The comments by iheartbb, above in this thread, are 100% spot on about Yuba City. They have a great baseball tradition, and Del Campo does as well, though not of the same level. Granite Bay does an outstanding job of running tournaments, and their coaches did a great job of breaking up the fight and then controlling this mess once they got onto the field.
Im sorry but that is just so wrong.
First base coach call pitchers mom a *****, then further disrespects her by telling somone, presumably male, to "tell that ***** to shut up".
So now a jv kid is expelled from school while the adult "educator" that startrd it gets a free pass?
Gutless AD and administration. Grow a set and deal with this fairly.
First base coach call pitchers mom a *****, then further disrespects her by telling somone, presumably male, to "tell that ***** to shut up".
So now a jv kid is expelled from school while the adult "educator" that startrd it gets a free pass?
Gutless AD and administration. Grow a set and deal with this fairly.
quote:Originally posted by 06catcherdad:
the Del Campo coach for responding with "Someone tell that B**ch to shut up" (That's what I've been told he said, and she happened to be the pitcher's mom.)
OK, this is where it went from a JV baseball game to the game of real life. No one talks about anyone's mom. Period. If I were the pitcher, I wouldn't have thrown the ball at the coach (if I heard him say it). I would have gone over and punched him right in the mouth. Maybe, he would have swung back and got the best of me, maybe the other team would have jumped me, but, in my book, 'moms' (anyone's mom) are simply out of bounds, and will be defended. If the kid is expelled, the DC coach should be fired.
First off. I do not condone the actions of the players in any way. But coaches that talk smack to rattle an opposing player are def out there. My son plays SS and runs into 4 or 5 every year between travel and HS. They are very good at making comments and not being caught at it. THey will try anything to get a player to not focus. Ask your infielders, coaches, ask your kids, parents. They are out there and they have ran into them before. The coaches that do it are basically just bullies that know that the players can't respond without penalty.
Gentlemen, I completely agree that if the DC coach said what I was told he said, he should be severely disciplined, up to possible firing. There is no justifying an educator, and remember that nearly all high school coaches ARE teachers in the classroom besides being coaches on the field, saying what he is alleged to have said.
That being said, there is still NO justification for the pitcher to throw at him, or to go over and punch him as is being suggested. It might be the 'right' thing to do in our eyes (heck, I feel the same way) but there are times where a student-athlete has to put his emotions away and deal with it properly. He could have asked for time out and demanded that the coach be disciplined, if not through his coach, then himself. He could have walked off the mound and refused to pitch until the coach was removed from the game. He could have done a lot of things to make his point in an appropriate manner, instead of throwing the ball at the coach. Once the kid did what he did, he lost any and all consideration for leniency for his actions, no matter how offended he may have felt. If he wanted to confront the coach, he should have waited till after the game and discussed it off the field. He SHOULD have maintained his demeanor and then filed a written complaint with the AD and Principal of Del Campo against the coach, and had his coach and athletic department do the same. Had the student-athlete done that instead of attacking hthe coach, he'd have likely gotten the coach a serious penalty without any repercussions to himself. As it is, he's going to pay a higher penalty than anyone else, and rightly so.
That being said, there is still NO justification for the pitcher to throw at him, or to go over and punch him as is being suggested. It might be the 'right' thing to do in our eyes (heck, I feel the same way) but there are times where a student-athlete has to put his emotions away and deal with it properly. He could have asked for time out and demanded that the coach be disciplined, if not through his coach, then himself. He could have walked off the mound and refused to pitch until the coach was removed from the game. He could have done a lot of things to make his point in an appropriate manner, instead of throwing the ball at the coach. Once the kid did what he did, he lost any and all consideration for leniency for his actions, no matter how offended he may have felt. If he wanted to confront the coach, he should have waited till after the game and discussed it off the field. He SHOULD have maintained his demeanor and then filed a written complaint with the AD and Principal of Del Campo against the coach, and had his coach and athletic department do the same. Had the student-athlete done that instead of attacking hthe coach, he'd have likely gotten the coach a serious penalty without any repercussions to himself. As it is, he's going to pay a higher penalty than anyone else, and rightly so.
quote:Originally posted by 06catcherdad:
That being said, there is still NO justification for the pitcher to throw at him, or to go over and punch him as is being suggested. It might be the 'right' thing to do in our eyes (heck, I feel the same way) but there are times where a student-athlete has to put his emotions away and deal with it properly. He could have asked for time out and demanded that the coach be disciplined, if not through his coach, then himself. He could have walked off the mound and refused to pitch until the coach was removed from the game. He could have done a lot of things to make his point in an appropriate manner, instead of throwing the ball at the coach. Once the kid did what he did, he lost any and all consideration for leniency for his actions, no matter how offended he may have felt. If he wanted to confront the coach, he should have waited till after the game and discussed it off the field. He SHOULD have maintained his demeanor and then filed a written complaint with the AD and Principal of Del Campo against the coach, and had his coach and athletic department do the same. Had the student-athlete done that instead of attacking hthe coach, he'd have likely gotten the coach a serious penalty without any repercussions to himself. As it is, he's going to pay a higher penalty than anyone else, and rightly so.
Great Post!!!!You are 100% correct on this. There are many ways of handling this in a non violent manner. And suggesting that a HS kid punch a coach for what ever he says is crazy.
"If I were the pitcher, I wouldn't have thrown the ball at the coach (if I heard him say it). I would have gone over and punched him right in the mouth."
You get what you deserve at that point and it should be criminal. Opinions like that are the reasons a mess like this happens. As someone said earlier "Sticks and Stones".
quote:You get what you deserve at that point and it should be criminal.
UHH, there is a fair bit of talk the the Placer County Sheriff's Department may initiate their own investigation into this matter. Nobody called in to 911, but the sheriff's department has become aware of the fight, and any fight of that magnitude on school property is ripe for investigation beyond the involved school's athletic departments, and the CIF. The Placer sheriff's department has indicated that they are doing some preliminary inquiry to detemrine if a more thorough investigation is warranted.
For the record, I do not disagree in principle with Antzdad about defending the honor of one's mother. In fact, years ago, one of my players got tired of his mom being called a 'MILF'by some of his fellow students, and he turned around and punched a kid who said that to him one day about the kids mom while they were waiting in line in the school cafeteria. He got his butt kicked for his trouble, but I was always proud of that kid for defending his mother's honor. As I recall, he got in trouble with the Principal's office, but was not suspended when they heard why he threw the first punch. The Principal had a mom too, so he 'got it'.
quote:Originally posted by shortnquick:
And suggesting that a HS kid punch a coach for what ever he says is crazy.
"If I were the pitcher, I wouldn't have thrown the ball at the coach (if I heard him say it). I would have gone over and punched him right in the mouth."
You get what you deserve at that point and it should be criminal. Opinions like that are the reasons a mess like this happens. As someone said earlier "Sticks and Stones".
I'm not suggesting that's what anyone should do. I'm telling you what would happen.
