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182 replies

Yuba City High JV baseball involved in brawl

standballdadstandballdad5,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by speakup:
The misconception seems to be that this "issue" was either an isolated incident with name calling in the 6th inning when the reality is that it had gone on the whole game. While I understand that players will jaw at each other during games, a coach should NEVER participate. High school coaches are bound by both CIF and NFHS regulations that explicitly name
'taunting players or parents' and 'using profanity' as unacceptable behaviors. I don't care if this is baseball and this is what has been done for years... we are spending hours every day reinforcing in these kids that if you are being bullied by adults you need to speak up. Those kids were being harassed, spoke up for 5 innings and were ignored. What nobody cares to mention is that the video used for punishment and all over the news was shot by the DC head coaches daughter and doesn't show any of the actions leading up to the YC altercation. There is no video of the DC players or parent involvement, but it existed. Why is that do you suppose? The pitcher should not have thrown the ball at the coach, I will give you that, but the coach should not have been there to have a ball thrown at him. These boys have now had everything they love taken away from them, and honestly just because you didn't see it on a video doesn't mean it didn't happen. DC played the next day, seems the video did it's job. Do some research people, look into the athletics program at Del Campo, and at YC. Seems to me that the media convicted these kids but hey, don't believe me, I'm just somebody that knows both teams well.


It does not matter what the coach said. Throwing the ball at the coach and then physically attacking him is wrong on so many levels. If this taunting went on for so long, why didn't the player tell his coach and if he did, why didn't the YC coach take care of it? Why didn't the umpire issue warnings? The player could have called time out and talked to his head coach or the umpire, but throwing the ball and attacking the antagonizing coach? Never!
S speakupMember
I absolutely agree with you that the player should have told his coach, and once again you are assuming that he didn't, and that he didn't ask the coach to stop. The umpire FAILED to stop the out of control behavior over 5 INNINGS of baseball. The umpire refused to do anything about it, which is another issue altogether. As an official myself I take full responsibility for the games I am assigned. The first time that coach opened his mouth to address the other team, he would have been gone. That is simply not ok. The adults have an obligation to provide a safe environment for these kids to play in and safe means free from adult harassment, bullying, and taunting. We failed. When children feel cornered they react, and usually do something stupid. Yes, the Yuba City pitcher made a stupid decision but the criticism and penalties to the whole baseball program are undeserved and wrong. Adults are so quick to make decisions that are going to impact these KIDS whole lives and say they should have known. Yes, they should have, and so should have the adults, but they didn't and the best answer that everyone can come up with is to kick them out of the school, away from all of their friends and/or take away the one thing that has kept them busy and out of trouble. Not one administrator, coach, or parent involved honestly believes that any of these kids presents a danger to any student or teacher on campus which is the ONLY justifiable(meaning without valid appeal) (by ca ed code) reason to expel a student.
coach2709coach270910,000+ posts
Does everyone on here know the difference between suspended and expelled? NOBODY in their right mind is going to expel a kid over this. Expulsion means you can NEVER go back to that school and with No Child Left Behind it's impossible for a kid not be enrolled in a school. Now I think it's justifiable to suspend these kids from school where they cannot attend for a set number of days.

The thing I don't get is all you people who are apologists for the kids. You guys want 100% of the blame to fall on the coaches, umps, AD and / or parents. Don't get me wrong they have their fair share of blame but you can't excuse the kids in this matter. If you always apologize or find an excuse for the kids at what point do they learn they are held accountable for their actions? Do you really think they magically learn right from wrong without ever facing some type of discipline for their mistakes?

The adults messed up - they need to be punished. The kids messed up - they need to be punished as well.
standballdadstandballdad5,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by speakup:
I absolutely agree with you that the player should have told his coach, and once again you are assuming that he didn't, and that he didn't ask the coach to stop. The umpire FAILED to stop the out of control behavior over 5 INNINGS of baseball. The umpire refused to do anything about it, which is another issue altogether. As an official myself I take full responsibility for the games I am assigned. The first time that coach opened his mouth to address the other team, he would have been gone. That is simply not ok. The adults have an obligation to provide a safe environment for these kids to play in and safe means free from adult harassment, bullying, and taunting. We failed. When children feel cornered they react, and usually do something stupid. Yes, the Yuba City pitcher made a stupid decision but the criticism and penalties to the whole baseball program are undeserved and wrong. Adults are so quick to make decisions that are going to impact these KIDS whole lives and say they should have known. Yes, they should have, and so should have the adults, but they didn't and the best answer that everyone can come up with is to kick them out of the school, away from all of their friends and/or take away the one thing that has kept them busy and out of trouble. Not one administrator, coach, or parent involved honestly believes that any of these kids presents a danger to any student or teacher on campus which is the ONLY justifiable(meaning without valid appeal) (by ca ed code) reason to expel a student.


They physically assaulted the coach. It was beyond stupid. These kids have it in them to be extremely violent. What they did will never be okay, I really don't care what the dumb coach did. Why would you continue to defend these kids action? Clearly no one is defending the coaches actions. They are all guilty and need to be punished.
S speakupMember
Matt13, I work with kids every day of the week and have for over 22 years. I have worked with the kids we term gifted and the kids labeled as the 'troublemakers' by school systems. Do not insult my intelligence, nor my experience with these kids by suggesting that my comment was out of line or inaccurate. Coach 2709, one student has already been expelled and one more is up for expulsion. I agree NOBODY in their right mind would expel a kid for this however the administration in the Yuba City Unified School District is not known to be real logical. I fully support suspending the kids, I think that they should have to rake the fields before and after the games for the rest of the season as well as miss a number of games. I think they should have to spend their lunch hours talking to kids at elementary and middle schools about good sportsmanship and how they can avoid the problems that they, themselves have had. Use this as a teaching tool so that these players learn from their mistake instead of just being punished. I promise you that at this age those boys will not learn anything valuable from being kicked off of the team. I know these kids, they don't have any more potential in them to be violent than you or I. I continue to defend these kids actions because they are kids, and the adults involved refuse to see that until they are TAUGHT the right way to behave they will not learn it.
Bulldog 19Bulldog 195,000+ posts
quote:
I know these kids, they don't have any more potential in them to be violent than you or I.


I don't recall in my 15+ years of playing competitive sports one time where I attacked anybody. I don't recall throwing a baseball as hard as I could at somebody.

Not only do they have the potential to be violent, they were violent. The pitcher especially deserves every and any penalty they hit him with.

They are definitely not victims.
mcmmccmmcmmccm100+ posts
Speakup, I agree 100%. Make it a learning situation. Just throwing these kids away is the simple (cowardly,pointless) way out.

If this were a men's softball game or a pro game, it would have gone down the same way. There would have been a scrap if an adult pitcher's wife had been insulted. Why are we expecting kids to act differently? Shake hands, apologize and move on.
55mom55mom1,000+ posts
AL fight from last summer

There was an incident in which a catcher and pitcher conspired and threw a fastball which injured the umpire. (I can't remember enough details to find a link.)

These incidents make me sick. In the JV baseball game, there is enough blame to go around - the adults on the field were out of control yet they seemingly walk away ... but the boys are hung out to dry. That makes no sense to me.
Bulldog 19Bulldog 195,000+ posts
quote:
the adults on the field were out of control yet they seemingly walk away ... but the boys are hung out to dry. That makes no sense to me.


Did the adults commit a crime? They may not have been very smart here, but I don't know that any of them broke the law...

The pitcher could be charged with a few different crimes if a prosecutor wanted to do so.

-Felony Assault
-Inciting a Riot
-More?
55mom55mom1,000+ posts
Bulldog, I'm not taking about locking up the adults. imo, coaches have a special role - they spend a lot time with young kids, in this particular case a JV team. They are role models. They are supposed to be the mature ones. Even though it appears that a general lack of maturity, on both sides of the fence, prevailed this game, the coach should have never yelled or used profanity to a parent.
mcmmccmmcmmccm100+ posts
I am saddened for many on this site that have not enjoyed the benefit of a loving relationship with their mother for which defending their honor does not seem rational. Having been raised by a loving mother and father myself I can't imagine how much more value would be given to a loving, dedicated single mother who is the sole source of familial love.

Additionally, anyone who would compare defending his mother's honor to the decision to drink and drive has obviously had a few to many baseballs upside the head. Seriously!!!
Last edited by mcmmccm
coach2709coach270910,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by mcmmccm:
I am saddened for many on this site that have not enjoyed the benefit of a loving relationship with their mother for which defending their honor does not seem rational. Having been raised by a loving mother and father myself I can't imagine how much more value I would be given to a loving, dedicated single mother who is the sole source of familial love.

Additionally, anyone who would compare defending his mother's honor to the decision to drink and drive has obviously had a few to many baseballs upside the head. Seriously!!!


Stop whatever it is you're doing at this minute and call your mom on the phone. Ask her if she would want you to commit a criminal act where you could go to jail and be sued for any injuries caused all because someone said something bad about her. Come back and tell us what she said. You can defend your mother's honor without resulting to violence or other stupid acts.
shortnquickshortnquick500+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by mcmmccm:
I am saddened for many on this site that have not enjoyed the benefit of a loving relationship with their mother for which defending their honor does not seem rational.


From a law enforcement perspective, you may choose to defend one's honor if that's the way you think you should handle a situation like this or another. But understand with that decision to "defend someone's honor" results in consequences. The reason there usually are consequences that disrupt one's life is purposeful. If defending someone’s honor is so important, then you can't really complain about the consequence. The consequence is supposed to not make it convenient for someone to use the defend ones honor defense again, but in fact to force that person and others to think twice or look for an alternate way of solving the problem.
S SwampboyHSBBWeb Administrator
quote:
Originally posted by mcmmccm:
I am saddened for many on this site that have not enjoyed the benefit of a loving relationship with their mother for which defending their honor does not seem rational. Having been raised by a loving mother and father myself I can't imagine how much more value would be given to a loving, dedicated single mother who is the sole source of familial love.



mcmmccm,

Your post is intellectually dishonest and morally repugnant.

To assert that those who disagree with you must not have had loving relationships with their mothers is to stoop to the level of the coach whom you think deserved to get beat up. By your own logic, since you just insulted my mother (by saying she didn't provide a loving relationship), I should storm on up to Maryland and "rationally" kick your butt. I mean, honor demands it, right? Isn't that your code?

But I won't do it because: a) I know you don't have a clue what you're talking about, so your comment about the quality of my relationship with my mother has no bearing on reality, b) I recognize you have basically conceded that you are now so out of rational arguments that all you have left is attacking the mothers of your adversaries, and c) I'm smart enought to figure out that physically punishing you will create new problems without solving any. You'd still be a stupid, but I'd be in trouble.

I am saddened for many on this site who are so insecure that they think ignorant schoolyard taunts actually have the power to compromise their mother's honor and who so twist the meanings of words that they can convince themselves that an irrational violent tantrum is actually a rational course of action.

P.S. Oh, yeah, and d) you might be a better fighter than I am.
Last edited by Swampboy
mcmmccmmcmmccm100+ posts
Coach2709, I have tons of respect for you and all you contribute to this site. However, I don't have to call my mom for the answer. I would support my son, period! The value I place on my mom and her honor is something I wouldn't ask her to confirm. Good thought though. I like the way you think. I will call her and tell her how much I love her. If only I could find someone to beat up to show her…. I know it sounds silly when it’s put that way.

"Criminal act" The simple act of how we back out of our driveway and where we place our trash cans could be viewed as a criminal act. Let’s use our brains rather than create laws by the truckload for our government to hold over our heads. This is part of the problem, where hysteria rules the day. It was a simple schoolyard brawl. Let's not make it more than that. No one got hurt.

Make the guilty parties DO something positive rather than remove possibly one of the only positive things in their lives, Adults and Players alike.
mcmmccmmcmmccm100+ posts
Swampboy,

I am glad to read that you at least though about coming to MD to Kick my butt. I believe your mother is worth it.

Perhaps you're right. It was a cheap shot and inappropriate to insult anyone's relationship with their mother. Please accept my most humble apology. What can I do to make amends? I would be happy to send your mother some flowers and thank her myself for the fine job she did raising you. (I am not being sarcastic!!)

But what now... should I be kicked off this web site permanently?

You are obviously a great thinker! Thanks for the response.
BW Bob Williams500+ posts
Unfortunately, this JV baseball game has National media attention and the School administrators, the CIF and the Courts will decide the outcome.

From the players, coaches and umpires actions the exhibits the "lack of respect" for the game of baseball.

"Catchers dad" has entered our tournaments for many years and traveled to Australia. He would never have allowed his team to be "out of control".

In 1984, I selected Larry Quirrico as our American team coach for our 1st International journey to Japan.

In the Spring of the year, my son Robert [age 14] and I traveled to El Cerrito to watch Larry's #1 ranked team in USA play Berkeley HS coached by Pumpsie Green, former Boston Red Sox infielder. IN the 3rd inning, "Pops" Mitchell one of our selected players to Japan slide "hard" into the Berkeley 3b. A "fight" irrupted, the umpires quickly "threw up" their arms and cancelled the game. They "raced" to their cars.

Larry Q; gathered his team in LF in a circle like General George Custer. Pumspie did the best he could to convince his players to drop the metal bats [weapons].

In 1984, of course there were no camera phones and Robert and I a few scouts walked quietly to our cars. This was a most "unforgettable" experience.

"a true story"

Bob
Last edited by Bob Williams
C CBMDad100+ posts
quote:
I am saddened for many on this site that have not enjoyed the benefit of a loving relationship with their mother for which defending their honor does not seem rational. Having been raised by a loving mother and father myself I can't imagine how much more value would be given to a loving, dedicated single mother who is the sole source of familial love.


WOW!!! If the Coach was hit in the head & severly injured would it still be a rational act? A teenager attacked an Adult for allegedly insulting his Mother. Whatever happened to sticks & stones???
S SwampboyHSBBWeb Administrator
quote:
Originally posted by mcmmccm:
Swampboy,

I am glad to read that you at least though about coming to MD to Kick my butt. I believe your mother is worth it.

Perhaps you're right. It was a cheap shot and inappropriate to insult anyone's relationship with their mother. Please accept my most humble apology. What can I do to make amends? I would be happy to send your mother some flowers and thank her myself for the fine job she did raising you. (I am not being sarcastic!!)

But what now... should I be kicked off this web site permanently?

You are obviously a great thinker! Thanks for the response.


No need for flowers, but that was a very gracious reply. Now I feel bad about responding harshly to you. Perhaps a beer summit is in order.
S speakupMember
The CIF has opted to allow the schools to deal with this situation. We are obviously not going to agree on this situation, and that is ok. We all bring different life experience and views to the discussion and I appreciate reading others opinions. Please understand that while it may seem that I am someone that excuses kids for their actions and believes they are all victims of their circumstances, this is not true. When you see these kids as they really are, sans bravado, it tends to make you think harder about what should be done. I've read repeatedly on this thread the saying, 'sticks and stones' and that the pitcher knew what he was doing throwing the ball and therefore deserves every punishment that could possibly be given him. I have inserted a few studies by respected sources that show differently. He screwed up, yes, and so did the umpire and the coach.
Verbal abuse has been defined as taunting, yelling, insulting, using profanity, or making threats against player or players family.

The old school of thought was along the lines of the nursery school rhyme “sticks and stones will break my bones, but words will never hurt me.” The old school of thought was that a little yelling at players will “toughen them up and prepare them for real life.” Fortunately, we now know better. A 2003 study by Dr. Stephen Joseph at University of Warwick found that “verbal abuse can have more impact upon victims’ self-worth than physical attacks, such as punching…stealing or the destruction of belongings.”


A 2007 Penn State study found that the trauma endured by children due to bullying results in physical changes in the body. The study, performed by JoLynn Carney, found that levels of cortisol, the stress hormone, were elevated in the saliva of both children who had been bullied recently and in those children who were anticipating being bullied in the near future. Ironically, when cortisol levels spike, our ability to think clearly, learn or remember goes right out the window. So those coaches who rely on fear and intimidation ensure their athletes won’t recall any of what they said while they are ranting and raving.
M Matt1310,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by speakup:
The CIF has opted to allow the schools to deal with this situation. We are obviously not going to agree on this situation, and that is ok. We all bring different life experience and views to the discussion and I appreciate reading others opinions. Please understand that while it may seem that I am someone that excuses kids for their actions and believes they are all victims of their circumstances, this is not true. When you see these kids as they really are, sans bravado, it tends to make you think harder about what should be done. I've read repeatedly on this thread the saying, 'sticks and stones' and that the pitcher knew what he was doing throwing the ball and therefore deserves every punishment that could possibly be given him. I have inserted a few studies by respected sources that show differently. He screwed up, yes, and so did the umpire and the coach.
Verbal abuse has been defined as taunting, yelling, insulting, using profanity, or making threats against player or players family.

The old school of thought was along the lines of the nursery school rhyme “sticks and stones will break my bones, but words will never hurt me.” The old school of thought was that a little yelling at players will “toughen them up and prepare them for real life.” Fortunately, we now know better. A 2003 study by Dr. Stephen Joseph at University of Warwick found that “verbal abuse can have more impact upon victims’ self-worth than physical attacks, such as punching…stealing or the destruction of belongings.”


A 2007 Penn State study found that the trauma endured by children due to bullying results in physical changes in the body. The study, performed by JoLynn Carney, found that levels of cortisol, the stress hormone, were elevated in the saliva of both children who had been bullied recently and in those children who were anticipating being bullied in the near future. Ironically, when cortisol levels spike, our ability to think clearly, learn or remember goes right out the window. So those coaches who rely on fear and intimidation ensure their athletes won’t recall any of what they said while they are ranting and raving.


I would suggest you look at how these studies defined "bullying." Insults hurled by a random stranger (while, yes, an adult and in a position of authority) are not commensurate with chronic periods of ridicule by peers or adults in persistent roles of authority.

Even if, if, this pitcher had an unknown propensity towards negative behavior from an unexpected stimulus, it is safe to assume (absent evidence to the contrary) that he had some modicum of control in his negative behavior. Secondly, and perhaps more importantly, his teammates seeing his reaction should have been more struck by the disproportionate level to which he took it. The reality is, they didn't. Is understandable why all the players reacting to the throw did what they did? Yep. Is it appropriate? Absolutely not. Hence, the enforcement of consequences.

Is it understandable that my toddler throws a tantrum when she doesn't get her way? Yep. Does that mean she avoids consequences? Nope.

This isn't to say that the level of cognizance of a 17-year-old is the same as a 3-year-old. However, both are in the developmental stages (generally,) and more importantly, when involving negative stimuli in a group setting, to (most) actors in these age groups, the group takes precedence over the individual. The ability to individualize the stimulus and to compartmentalize the consequences are not developed.
Last edited by Matt13
coach2709coach270910,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by mcmmccm:
Coach2709, I have tons of respect for you and all you contribute to this site. However, I don't have to call my mom for the answer. I would support my son, period! The value I place on my mom and her honor is something I wouldn't ask her to confirm. Good thought though. I like the way you think. I will call her and tell her how much I love her. If only I could find someone to beat up to show her…. I know it sounds silly when it’s put that way.

"Criminal act" The simple act of how we back out of our driveway and where we place our trash cans could be viewed as a criminal act. Let’s use our brains rather than create laws by the truckload for our government to hold over our heads. This is part of the problem, where hysteria rules the day. It was a simple schoolyard brawl. Let's not make it more than that. No one got hurt.

Make the guilty parties DO something positive rather than remove possibly one of the only positive things in their lives, Adults and Players alike.


I can respect this post and especially the part where you said you were going to call your mom to tell her how much you love her. That's some good stuff.
mcmmccmmcmmccm100+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by Jimmy03:
quote:
Originally posted by mcmmccm:
I would support my son, period!


I would support my son, too. I would extend unconditional love and I would support him as he accepted the consequences of his actions. I would not excuse him.


I agree there should be consequences and I would support in the inforcement and effect on his Character. I still maintain that expulsion is counter productive.
LB luv baseball5,000+ posts
The whole concept of "disrespect" being a reason to attack people physically is something that has evovled in the last 20 years or so.

The "mother" thing goes back forever. Here's the thing I struggle to understand. Why would a total strangers meaningless opinion/statement about my mother, father, wife, kids etc be a reason for me to get upset? Why should I care what an ignorant fool thinks much less respond to it?

What makes me sad is that people are fired up over this topic but half of them won't vote this fall. That is something that matters and does impact ALL of us.
BBfamBBfam500+ posts
Latest news is that the Del Campo boys and their coach received either a one or two day suspension. That is the coach that started the mess by comments made to a parent in the stands and a player on the field.

The pitcher has accepted full responsiblity for his actions. He knows that while going after the coach was wrong, he is not sorry for defending his mother.

The YC boys are learning a rough lesson. They've learned that sometimes lying is the way to go. They've learned that adults don't always have their back. They've learned that whatever the circumstance, cover your a$$. That is not the lesson I wanted my son to learn.

Personally, I agree with the 1 or 2 game suspension for the boys. YC and DC. Some of our boys deserve more, as do some of the DC boys. You just can't see their actions on the video.

Our boys are still being called in. My son has to see the VP for the 3rd time in a week. He's made his statement. It isn't changing. I am personally tired of it. They are wanting the boys to turn on each other and the coaches. Bad example to set as well.

Our new policy now is that if an altercation on the field takes place, the bench stays put ( I agree) and that the fielders are to walk off while the pitcher is left to take a beating unil the coaches get there. He is not allowed to defend himself. As the parent of pitchers, I am not happy about that. But the school has proved that if he defends himself in any manner, it is an automatic susupension and removal from the team. I am really, really struggling with this.

Coaches, what is your opinion? I know all policies will be different but am curious as to what you tell your players if they are being hit.
55mom55mom1,000+ posts
BBfam - I just have to ask - are fights breaking out so common that you think/worry about it? A brawl on the high school field never crossed my mind in the four years my son played. Never in legion - 1 season, nor in college now pitching as a freshman. I would hope this incident is exception.

We've had some nasty games too. Last year, in the regional game, son was called names and his manhood questioned. It was the worst I've seen fans behave. (So he struck out 5 of 6 entering a tied game for the win. He did it again the next night.) I was never concerned that the benches would clear, just that I was going to have a heart attack.

As far as trying to pit the players against each other, I don't particularly like that strategy. Interview the umpires, the coaches and ask each player what they did. Make a decision and move on.

Good luck with everything. I know it's tough, but y'all can rise above and be better in the long run.
Last edited by 55mom
standballdadstandballdad5,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by speakup:
The CIF has opted to allow the schools to deal with this situation. We are obviously not going to agree on this situation, and that is ok. We all bring different life experience and views to the discussion and I appreciate reading others opinions. Please understand that while it may seem that I am someone that excuses kids for their actions and believes they are all victims of their circumstances, this is not true. When you see these kids as they really are, sans bravado, it tends to make you think harder about what should be done. I've read repeatedly on this thread the saying, 'sticks and stones' and that the pitcher knew what he was doing throwing the ball and therefore deserves every punishment that could possibly be given him. I have inserted a few studies by respected sources that show differently. He screwed up, yes, and so did the umpire and the coach.
Verbal abuse has been defined as taunting, yelling, insulting, using profanity, or making threats against player or players family.

The old school of thought was along the lines of the nursery school rhyme “sticks and stones will break my bones, but words will never hurt me.” The old school of thought was that a little yelling at players will “toughen them up and prepare them for real life.” Fortunately, we now know better. A 2003 study by Dr. Stephen Joseph at University of Warwick found that “verbal abuse can have more impact upon victims’ self-worth than physical attacks, such as punching…stealing or the destruction of belongings.”


A 2007 Penn State study found that the trauma endured by children due to bullying results in physical changes in the body. The study, performed by JoLynn Carney, found that levels of cortisol, the stress hormone, were elevated in the saliva of both children who had been bullied recently and in those children who were anticipating being bullied in the near future. Ironically, when cortisol levels spike, our ability to think clearly, learn or remember goes right out the window. So those coaches who rely on fear and intimidation ensure their athletes won’t recall any of what they said while they are ranting and raving.


This is not a case of bullying that those studies refer too. Just not the same thing.
S speakupMember
Actually, that is what I do so on this particular subject I know what I am talking about. These studies were actually referring to exactly this type of bullying in addition to coaches bullying their own teams to 'supposedly' increase performance. We may not know why these things seem to affect some kids more than others but it has been determined by those that have studied it to be so prevalent that schools have laws in place clearly stating that it does NOT have to be over a period of time to be bullying. Once again, the pitcher should not have reacted the way he did and the players should not have participated but I specialize in this one area it IS considered bullying.
standballdadstandballdad5,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by speakup:
Actually, that is what I do so on this particular subject I know what I am talking about. These studies were actually referring to exactly this type of bullying in addition to coaches bullying their own teams to 'supposedly' increase performance. We may not know why these things seem to affect some kids more than others but it has been determined by those that have studied it to be so prevalent that schools have laws in place clearly stating that it does NOT have to be over a period of time to be bullying. Once again, the pitcher should not have reacted the way he did and the players should not have participated but I specialize in this one area it IS considered bullying.


Where was the intimidation and fear you are speaking of. He was saying things about his mother that the pitcher did not appreciate. Your reference to the study talks about coaches that yell and scream at there own players to try and enhance performance. I still do not see the connection you are trying to make here. It was a baseball game that had a lot of jawing from BOTH sides and nothing more. Things got out of hand and now people need to deal with the consequences. Your painting this picture of bullying and it just does not hold water with me. Sorry
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