Area Code Team Tryouts

quote:

I thought the players travel expenses were funded to California.

YOU, my friend, are sadly mistaken.

It will cost at least 4 grand to be on that team. Thats the low side.

1. plane tickets, player, mom, dad.
2. car rental for a week
3. motel for 7 days
4. 3 squares a day plus at least one extra for the player
5. spending money
6. buying area code hats and shirts
7. and then other incidentals

sure no cost to tryout once you get to tryout site and or LONG BEACH.

1000

Well, I have been wrong before, but not ever sad about it very long..........

I've got some friends that went. I'll ask them who funded and, if they did, how much it cost.

I have a feeling that most baseball parents are aware that baseball is expensive.

quote:

Originally posted by Vance34:

It will cost at least 4 grand to be on that team. Thats the low side.

I think most families are getting used to the high cost of baseball travel by the time the players are elgible for Area Code....select baseball has conditioned us to being accustomed to opening up our pocketbooks for out of state travel, lessons, team fees, equipment, etc. No, I don't enjoy shelling out $5k+ a year (that is the low side) on baseball and skipping summer vacations but I wouldn't trade it or the memories for anything in the world..priceless.

quote:

Originally posted by Bighit15:
Let us not forget how exciting and fun it is for all the players.

Good job of bringing up the proper perspective,
BH.

quote:

Originally posted by Ken Guthrie:

quote:

But I would appreciate a more direct approach.

And I can appreciate your request, and actually I would rather do it your way. But sometimes when I post directly what I think, parents get offended. But I will certainly try...........

I have to agree with Ken on this point. He has gotten blasted in the past and you can’t really blame him for trying to stimulate a good discussion without starting another flame war. I have been wondering how long it would take before someone let the cat out of the bag and identified his intentional technique in this case. If it worked for Socrates why shouldn’t it work for Ken? I thought it was pretty slick.

As for the AC tryouts it seems like the B and C list players might have the most to gain from this mass, though brief, exposure even if they won’t make the AC team. It could be a chance to spark renewed or additional interest. Maybe someone decides to make time later to see a kid play with his own team because he had a good day at the tryout. Maybe they get on the radar for a DII or JUCO that had overlooked them.

I don’t want to speak for Ken but I think his point might be that the A list players (true DI and pro prospects) will get signed even if they skip the AC tryout. The comparison to the NFL combine, and the top draft picks that skip it, seems fair. That doesn’t mean that attending wouldn’t be a great (and free) experience for most kids. Just don't look at the invitation as a fast track to The Show.

quote:

As for the AC tryouts it seems like the B and C list players might have the most to gain from this mass, though brief, exposure even if they won’t make the AC team. It could be a chance to spark renewed or additional interest. Maybe someone decides to make time later to see a kid play with his own team because he had a good day at the tryout. Maybe they get on the radar for a DII or JUCO that had overlooked them.

It is also a chance for a player to be seen by college coaches who up to this point have only been exchanging e-mails or phone calls.

Wow,

Pretty good thread in my opinion.

To sum up what is so hard for me to understand is..............

and I said it before and will probably be misunderstood again.

In my opinion, it is sad to see that the a large emphasis on today's amatuer players are individual "tools/skills" workouts.

Is there anything really bad about it? No.

What does it really hurt? Nothing.

But what I think does is take away from what the true essence of what the great game really is.

And that is......to play a game you are passionate about with 8 other guys working towards a common goal. In doing so, so many life lessons are learned if absorbed in the correct atmosphere. Whether a player does it on a pee-wee team or a Super All American Premier Area Code Select team.

I just see too much importance put on such workouts that sometimes I wonder if young players really understands why they play and enjoy the game.

And for those who say I over estimate the importance to these players......Well, I have to say I have first hand experience.

But it's just like everything else I guess. Times change. To think I grew up watching "This Week in Baseball" on Saturday mornings, to where as now kids look forward to watching "Jack ***" on MTV.

Will I change anything? No.

I guess I need to learn to accept that. But it's hard for me to sit back and just accept things in which I think are a little off base.

Plus, discussions like this help me plan for my sons future. Then again, I will probably be worrying about what seat he has in band. My weekends will be taken up with band camps.

Sorry again, if I offended any parent. Again, congrats on your honors.

But please understand that when this game is done for your sons, which it will come sooner than later for most, that his memories won't be what workout he excelled at........

it will be the times he spent at the hotel playing cards, or the seed spitting contest during BP, or the road trip to Super Series National Invitational World Series. It's the things he does with his "brothers" that he will remember most. Don't let those opportunities pass by.

quote:

Don't let those opportunities pass by.

I ain't.

Or, view it as an honor. As fun. And as an opportunity (note: not a guarantee) to increase the chances of playing at the next level.

I just don't see why things like AC and "team" have to be mutually exclusive.

Thanks for putting those cards on the table, KG.

Unfortunately the child's game has turned into a business. Even at the select level. With the fight for scholarship money, coaches and players have to be business like.

It would be nice if it were just playing with you neighborhood buddies, and if you are good enough, getting to play at the next level. It isn't that way. People have to play against the best competition. So you pay bundles of money to do so (select). Parents want their children to have fun, but with all that output of money, they want results and effort. Not in a bad way, more in the way of saying, "hey junior, if you do this I will support you, but you need to to work at it. If all you want to do is hang out with friends and play, that is fine. Play rec ball"

College coaches want to spend their money wisely. It is just business. Parents search for the best fit of scholly and academics. They would like some return on their investment. Pro scouts want to know how much it will take. it is just business. Times have changed. Just the way it is. A child like love for the game gets lost in all of the striving and competition. jmo

I am never happier than when my son calls and is so happy about his performance, or has a funny story about his friends. It is hard to balance the business end with the just love playing. Something I have noticed even through all of the business end is that the players who don't LOVE it, don't last. Though it may make us sad to see all the bad things with all the striving. Most do it because they love to play the game and are willing to jump through some hoops to insure that they get a chance.

BH15, I hate to whine with you too much, but since you brought up the topic. I think think the most fun for the families, parents, etc. is select baseball prior to age 16 and then high school baseball. Of course rule number one is fun means success and winning, or at least being in the fight. By about age 16, the meaning of the team drops out of select ball. Many of the very top players have the opportunities like Area Code or Jr. Olympics and others and so only play with their base/home team occasionally. Select team coaches must scramble for pitchers for the big tournament because no team can have enough good pitching and you can't keep a bunch of good pitchers all on one team all season. They all need work. High school teams can still truly be teams, though.

By college and of course professional, it really is a business. The players have to truly love the game or they will burn out. The collegiate teams can still form a bond, but many don't. Same goes for professionals. If you think about it, at the professionial level, the team is not really most important concept for most players. The players are truly skilled craftsmen (what professionalism is about in most career fields.) Have you every wondered how Alex Rodriguez and Rod Jeter really get along, playing next to each other? How much do they really care about each other knowing it is unlikely they'll play the rest of their careers together. They only have a common goal (WS championship) for short period and they know it. In the long run, what's important to them is to maintain themselves as individuals and produce as much as they can. Every Major Leaguer has a different make-up but how many groups of players, coachets, etc. have they played with to get their? The good news is the college game still has a lot of good old American fun, apple pie and "school spirit."

quote:

Originally posted by OldDallas:
......I think think ..... coachets, etc. have they played with to get their? ...."

Sorry, PD et al. I promise to work on my there, their, they're's. So there!!

Maybe my son is naive, but when a friend or team mate gets cut, he still gets upset. They do bond. It may be different from the rah rah of college, but they are still brothers in arms. True, there are the totally selfish ones. That occurs on any team. Due to all the hurricanes last year, I was priviledged to have several players come here and stay during the 'canes. They were a joy to be around. They share a love for the game and they are where few get to go. That gives them a bond. There is still that boyish hope. They all have to learn to deal with the business side. As with anything else, as you get older, you get more focused and synical, but they still love the game. jmo

I don't want to put words into KG's mouth but I think that what really bothers him about Area Code and other "showcases" is the de-emphasis it puts on "team". I don't think there is any disputing that and i agree with KG that that is a trend that is growing.

Let's be honest - at the 16-18 year old level select summer teams are increasingly becoming "teams" that players play on when it is convenient for them. In other words when there are not Area Code, AFLAC, or Perfect Game showcases, or when there are not college camps or any number of events that take the player away from his select "team". Whether we like it or not these select "teams" are slowly becoming more of a collection of individuals who happen to wear the same uniform at certain times during the summer.

I don't have the answer and I struggle with this in dealing with my own son's quest to continue to play baseball beyond high school. I can honestly see within 10 years the demise of select "teams" as we know them. If what I see continues there will simply be a series of showcases or college camps that will take up most of the prime June - July summer schedules of most top "prospects" - and EVERY parent thinks their son is a "top" prospect.

Individualism is the way baseball is moving. I myself think the demise of baseball "teams" is not a good trend in the long run. Unfortunately we may all realize our loss after it is too late to do anything about it.

Now, with the above being said before anyone asks - if my son were lucky enough to get an Area Code invitation would he go?? Honestly, yes. But I would not feel good about him missing his summer team's games (even though they probably would not even miss him).

Ken, I think you are right on the mark in your last post with a couple minor exceptions.

My son does not waste his time watching “Jack A**”. He is to busy watching ESPN to find out what happened in today’s games.

He is a part time band geek too and loves to compete in marching contests during the off season. His band director makes it work because he also played baseball when he was in high school.

Ok, that stuff is true but I was just having a little fun with you too. We all know kids that fit the profile you described.

So what is the bottom line here? I don’t think the players can make the scouts do anything, but the scouts sure can influence the player’s behavior. If the scouts don’t think this info is helpful, why do they bother to show up? No scouts, no players.

My real question this. Who changed first? Was it the kids and parents or the system? And did the kids really abandon playing for the love of the game or have they just added this new behavior (attending showcases) in response to changes in the overall system that decides who gets to the next level of the game they still love to play?

It is a one day event, usually on a Monday or Tuesday, as it is this year, when there are not a lot of games going on.

About 20 boys from Texas, LA, OK, maybe make the Texas Rangers Area Code team that travels to California for one week, in August, late in the season.

That ain't messing up a whole lot of select teams...............

And, the two teams I am involved with right now, are pulling together pretty hard as teams.

quote:

Originally posted by Line Drive:
....
My real question this. Who changed first? Was it the kids and parents or the system? And did the kids really abandon playing for the love of the game or have they just added this new behavior (attending showcases) in response to changes in the overall system that decides who gets to the next level of the game they still love to play?

LD, I think it is just a sign of the times. It starts with the tremendous money, media and selfishness at the professional player. (I don't mean all professional players, just more and more of them. They are default role models, like it or not, although parents are still responsible for setting the record straight. Ultimately every kid dreams of the big leagues so it is only natural that if they really love the game and the dream, they'll go anywhere to make sure they get their shot.... of course with parents willing, support. What generation are we in? ... the "me" generation? I do also blame Title 9/10 or whatever is that screwed up most of the men's minor collegiate sports to divert money into women's athletics. The end result is college coaches have to be manipulate their limited scholarships and resources any way they can.

quote:

Originally posted by crawdad:
I don't want to put words into KG's mouth but I think that what really bothers him about Area Code and other "showcases" is the de-emphasis it puts on "team". I don't think there is any disputing that and i agree with KG that that is a trend that is growing.

Let's be honest - at the 16-18 year old level select summer teams are increasingly becoming "teams" that players play on when it is convenient for them. In other words when there are not Area Code, AFLAC, or Perfect Game showcases, or when there are not college camps or any number of events that take the player away from his select "team". Whether we like it or not these select "teams" are slowly becoming more of a collection of individuals who happen to wear the same uniform at certain times during the summer.

I don't have the answer and I struggle with this in dealing with my own son's quest to continue to play baseball beyond high school. I can honestly see within 10 years the demise of select "teams" as we know them. If what I see continues there will simply be a series of showcases or college camps that will take up most of the prime June - July summer schedules of most top "prospects" - and EVERY parent thinks their son is a "top" prospect.

Individualism is the way baseball is moving. I myself think the demise of baseball "teams" is not a good trend in the long run. Unfortunately we may all realize our loss after it is too late to do anything about it.

Now, with the above being said before anyone asks - if my son were lucky enough to get an Area Code invitation would he go?? Honestly, yes. But I would not feel good about him missing his summer team's games (even though they probably would not even miss him).

Crawdad, you and I see things alike I have noticed. Thanks for always putting things into a different context for some to understand. Maybe one day I can learn to express myself the same way.

All of my feelings toward my thoughts come from one sense of achievement.........

Pulling together and accomplishing something as a team.

Not that I have achieved anything special, but all of my opinions come from some experience.

1. Playing at the HS level.
2. Playing at the Junior College Level
3. Playing at the 4 year NAIA level.
4. Getting drafted and playing at the minor
league level.
5. Having the opportunity to experience the
Major Leagues behind the scenes on a daily
basis as a bullpen catcher.
6. Coaching select baseball from 15 all the
way up.

Maybe doing such and looking back give me the thoughts I try to translate.

Either way, I have come to realize that things are looked at differently from a parents and todays amatuer players.

As as far as times changing and who started first...........

Remember, $$$$$$$$$$$ money is the root of all evil.

Ken -- according to my score card, you have achieved many things special. Perhaps 6 of your top 10 or 15 are listed here.

quote:

Originally posted by Panther Dad:
Perhaps 6 of your top 10 or 15 are listed here.

?????confused.

I suppose I am assuming that a few of your top accomplishments do not include baseball.

You lived your dream for at least a short time --- seems like a special achievement to me.

Keep sharing your experiences. Even if people don't agree, they're valuable to these discussions.

And....you're getting smoother.

quote:

Originally posted by crawdad:

Let's be honest - at the 16-18 year old level select summer teams are increasingly becoming "teams" that players play on when it is convenient for them. .

I think we as a society have taught our children that there is no loyalty to either it be
a team or a job. I say this, because you rarely see the same kids stay on one team for
several years. Also, in the big world people change jobs often. The Pros rarely stay with the
same team, granted some of it is not their doing. We are all chasing the American Dream. !!!

quote:

Originally posted by Ken Guthrie:
......
Remember, $$$$$$$$$$$ money is the root of all evil.

Correction from NIV - 1 Timothy 6:10
"For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil."
I've heard a whole sermon on this... it's the "love" of money that is causing the problems.

quote:

Originally posted by FormerObserver:


About 20 boys from Texas, LA, OK, maybe make the Texas Rangers Area Code team that travels to California for one week, in August, late in the season.

That ain't messing up a whole lot of select teams...............

Unless about 6 starting pithcers come to you and say......

"Coach, I can't pitch this tournament because I have to throw at Area Code's on Monday"

You won't have that problem this year, will you...........

Guys, here is an article I ran across from a LHP who attended the area code workout last year. I'll only use the part of the article that involves the area code.

quote:

"I don't think Kevin realized how good he was until probably last year," Lee Angelle said. "After we got beat out in the state tournament, he got asked to try out for the Area Code Games."

Angelle wasn't picked to the final squads that play each summer in a weeklong series of showcase games in California, but his tryouts at the University of Texas and Houston's Minute Maid Park put him on the radar screens for all the pro and college teams.

The last tryout included a talk on the ins and outs of scouting by the scouts.

"That kind of opened my eyes," Lee Angelle said. "Me and Kevin both were busy trying to learn the ins and outs of college scholarships, and not the pro draft and all that other stuff.

"I didn't have any idea that was coming. That's when all this stuff started getting in our head. 'Gosh, he's good enough to go to the pros.'

"I knew he was good, but I didn't realize he had that potential."

Guys, Scouts have to have guys with Tools. Tools play in the big leagues. But it's not just about the Tools. There are alot of things. Instincts for the game, game awareness, poise, Character of the person, Makeup of the person. and YES, their skills and how they play the game. BUT YOU HAVE GOT TO HAVE TOOLS.

The most important season for a high school player is his High School season. NOT his select team season. Maybe if the Select teams would CUT DOWN to say ONLY a 100 games instead of 150. Maybe the kids could get to some of the showcase events. You know there are more HS kids having Tommy John and Labrum surgery than ever before. What really needs to be happening is kids need to practice more, AND NOT in an expensive INDOOR FACILITY. Kids just play games they never THROW A BALL AGAINST THE WALL FOR AN HOUR or PLAY PEPPER. They never practice so their Tools never get better.

The point of the mater is that the Area Code workout allows a scout to SEE ALL the players at one location without having to DRIVE all over Texas. The scout can make comparrisons of players.They can talk to the player. They can look him in the eye and see who has self esteem and who doesn't. They can meet a parent or answer a question.

The scout is the players best friend. He is the salesman for that player with his org. The Agent makes money on the player. The scout gets NOTHING when he signs a player.

The area code is an ALL STAR WEEK of the best high school players in the country. Just like little league and any other league that picks ALL-STARS. It does have WORTH. SLECT BALL is played so SOMEONE can make money. WHAT SELECT BALL SHOULD BE IS AN AVENUE FOR ADULTS TO HELP HIGH SCHOOL KIDS WITH A PASSION FOR BASEBALL GET EVERY OPPROTUNITY TO PLAY IN COLLEGE AT SOME LEVEL AND HELP THEIR PARENTS WITH SOME OF THE COST FOR COLLEGE. Not put a hundred thousnad dollars in the hands of the guy running the select team.

quote:

The scout gets NOTHING when he signs a player.

So, why do they do it, Vance?

You know, Vance, it pains me to think you are making money.

quote:

Originally posted by Vance34:
The most important season for a high school player is his High School season. NOT his select team season.

Can you provide any reasoning for that statement?

I make an honest living.

Why do scouts do it? Scouts get paid by SALARY not by who they sign. NOR do they get a BONUS for signing a player. WAKE UP

Texan, SURE. Lets take the kid at Cy Falls HS. Jenkins, RHP. He was a 1st rd pick by every publication leading into his Senior season. Bet he doesn't get drafted. Poor Senior HIGH SCHOOL SEASON. The season just before the draft is the MOST IMPORTANT for a draft elgible player.

Vance, you are creative.

All the scouts I know are getting a little cut.

So, you're telling me you are wide awake?

Texan, Lets take Kasparek, RHP at U of Texas. From Weimar HS. Was a projected 1st round pick coming into Senior HIGH SCHOOL SEASON. Poor Sr. season. Didn't get drafted.

FORMER OBSERVER then you know NO scouts. Not one gets a bonus or as you say a CUT. NOT ONE. This is 2006 not 1960

V, what were their Senior year fall select seasons like?

Reckon, it's possible they didn't draft Kasparek because he had a nice D1 scholly to UT?

Texan, Lets take the Bruce kid from Beaumont. 1st rd pick in 05. Was projected about the 5th round or even lower coming into his Sr. HIGH SCHOOL SEASON. Had a great HIGH SCHOOL season. Top half of 1st round pick. 1.8 million and NO the Reds scout didn't get a cut BUT the agent did.

Former Observer, aren't you the one who said Area Code was paid for by MLB. So stop typing what you think and passing false information. WILL YA?

Texan, Scouting Directors, General Managers, Cross Checkers DON'T see fall select stuff. Its the High School season of their Senior year, their draft year that is most important. Its right before the draft.

FORMER OBSERVER

NO, Kasparek was 90-94 at the SCOUTS Game in Minute Maid Park and he was 90-94 with a nasty breaker all fall in select ball. BUT he was 83-86 ALL SPRING LONG of his SENIOR HIGH SCHOOL SEASON.

Pro ball cares less about a college scholarship that a kid has. Pro ball gives 4 year FULL GUARANTEED COLLEGE SCHOLARSHIPS and colleges can only give one year and thats a partial at that.