At what age should daddy ball stop?

Well, uh Cal Ripken, Jr. played for his dad. It seemed to work out till Dad lost his job managing the Orioles.

There are infinite horror stories. There are infinite stories that warm the heart. Find a good dad coaching. Stay mobile.

If you are the "daddy," it is a no-win situation. When we started our AAU team 10 years ago, the advice the college coach where I worked gave me was...

...do NOT get trapped into your son being the SS...even if he is the best SS. You're better off moving your own son around as needed, instead of someone else's son.

And guess what. I did and STILL took heat for playing my son all over. I took heat LAST YEAR from parents because the HS coach did the same thing. I got the last laugh though, as the coach's advice has paid its dividends as now I have a versatile college freshman that loves the game because of where all he's played.

quote:

but doesn’t seem that it’s who you know and how you schmooze is more important than what you do?

This can be true in many parts of life... just the way it is.

When speaking of favor picks in the draft... I know a kid that was drafted out of HS. I can't believe that it was anything but embarassing for the kid. He couldn't hit or field. Had great speed though. It was obviously a favor to his dad and surely the kid knew it? That's not an emotion I would want my child to feel. That's not success by anyone's yard stick IMO.

It nevers really ends, Daddy Ball just turns into Money Ball, to "My parent is a town gov't official/teacher" Ball, and Heritage Ball, where a certain player is an "x" generation student at High School "y" and feels a sense of entitlement due to his very existence.

Hopefully I'm just having a bad day.

Be good enough that you have to be on the field. Then dont worry about Daddy Ball or politics or anything else negative. I would have been promoted but _________. I would have been __________ but. My son would have been __________ but. Excuses and complaints leave your child hollow and without solutions. The dad goes out puts the team together etc etc etc of course his son is going to play. How many rec level , travel teams etc etc have you ever seen where the dad was the coach and his kid sat the bench? Should anyone at that age be sitting the bench all the time? If your son can play he will play when it matters the most. If he cant play and he still does play are you going to complain to the coach and have him sit him? Just play the game. Be so good that they have to play you. At the lower levels its about learning the game and getting a solid fundemental base of the game. None of this stuff will matter down the road anyway. The best way to deal with it is to not worry about it. Dont focus on it. And dont use it as an excuse. Be above it and be better than your competition.

I got a great story - or at least I think it's great because it shut a daddy up. My first year as head coach ever was at a school that did not have any tradition of success at baseball. I come in and change everything. I ran off most of the older players because I wouldn't let them take Spring Break off to get drunk for a week.

I went with a very young team of 8 sophomores and 1 junior starting almost every game. I had strict standards and didn't put up with a bunch of junk - just trying to establish discipline. Well the parents hated me (they would go to the board of education demanding they fire me) and that was even the ones who were starting in the field.

Near the end of the season - by the way we got to the regional title game for the first time in school history (sorry had to brag a little) - I had this daddy tell me he was going to have a summer team of our guys. I thought that would be a good idea. He had this idea of "putting me in my place" and showing me "how a team should be run". He told me he was going to have tryouts and choose the absolute best players and strive to be an elite team. I innocently asked him why have tryouts since it was going to be our high school team and he would be lucky to have 12 guys at the games. He told me he was going to do it right.

Day of the tryouts we show up at the field and he tells me to watch how to run a true try out. Well that ticked me off. The tryout started and there were 7 kids at the tryout. He gave me a clipboard and told me to time guys running to first. Basically making me a secretary.

It was humorous on the things he did - he had two batting practice hitters going at the same time with two BP throwers. I asked what does a kid do when two balls are hit at them and he told me that could never happen. A kid almost lost his head because he was fielding a groundball while a linedrive was coming at him.

Needless to say the team never got off the ground and the next spring I very maturely kept asking how his team did that summer.

6

If not 6, then by 12.
Some dad's would make Great coaches.
But for the benefit of your player. Don't coach him.
At least don't coach him all year long.
Allow him a chance to see baseball outside of dad's care.

Sometime's there would be no team unless a dad started it.
But do it for the right reason's. To play baseball.

I'm a Dad, who stopped coaching my son when he turned 11 - that was about right for both of us so that he could grow, and I not ruin our relationship. But I raise a toast to all the Dads who SUCCESSFULLY coached their sons to greater things, and produced fine young men besides. Their are many sports success stories in college and pro baseball. In fact, I would argue that behind the majority of college, minor league and MLB players, there is a graying or balding Dad, who can look back with pride on his contribution to his player's development. Sorry, guys, but I think Dads sometimes get a bad rap, when they are much more often the foundation of athletic and personal success for their sons. I've seen and heard some horror stories too, but let's give credit where credit is due.

Well, if you're talking daddy ball so that junior can be the shortstop and pitcher that should end at around age 5 or 6.

I guess technically I'm doing daddy ball for a 13/14 year old youth team, but I think I'm doing it for some of the right reasons. Son has been on various teams which I have helped with, but I never felt he was getting any kind of quality instruction, productive practices, etc. One head coach was so wrapped up in himself he called the kids together in the middle of the field during a game and ripped them a new one for messing up a rundown (which had not been practiced at all that season). I've always said if you don't like the way something is then do something about it. So here I am playing head coach.

One of my biggest gripes is seeing coaches waste time at practice by being unprepared, having 9 kids stand around in the field doing nothing while a batter at the plate attempts to hit pitches that are over his head, or just running the same drills day after day. So I spend an hour or two a couple of nights before every practice and type up a practice plan and post it on our website so the kids can get ready for what we'll work on. I video pitching and batting and post slow motion clips on the website so the kids can see what they need to work on. I want the ones who strive to play high school ball to be ready for it.

My son is a pretty good kid and so on, but right off the bat he bugged me to put him at SS. Well, there are two kids on the team who I feel are better at SS than my son, so no SS. Son has caught for quite a while and is good at it, so right now he catches, plays 2nd, and plays outfield. I'd like to do something special for the catchers from time to time because sometimes they do take a beating in games (son certainly has), but since the coaches kid is a catcher none of them get any special treatment.

I don't pretend to know everything about baseball, there are certainly many coaches that know more than me. I study DVD's and books to stay ahead of the kids, and of course glean information from a few good web sites.

That's where I'm at with daddy-ball at the moment. So far my relationship with my son has stayed on a pretty even keel while being his coach. It's not always perfect, but we do pretty well. In a way it's an advantage because we communicate really well and as a catcher he picks up on a lot of stuff that the other catchers wouldn't think to tell me (Tom's changeup is awesome today; Joe's starting to lose his stuff; the ump's calling strikes off the outside corner, etc.)

quote:

Originally posted by brod:
I'm a Dad, who stopped coaching my son when he turned 11 - that was about right for both of us so that he could grow, and I not ruin our relationship. But I raise a toast to all the Dads who SUCCESSFULLY coached their sons to greater things, and produced fine young men besides. Their are many sports success stories in college and pro baseball. In fact, I would argue that behind the majority of college, minor league and MLB players, there is a graying or balding Dad, who can look back with pride on his contribution to his player's development. Sorry, guys, but I think Dads sometimes get a bad rap, when they are much more often the foundation of athletic and personal success for their sons. I've seen and heard some horror stories too, but let's give credit where credit is due.

Good point brod - there has to be someone pushing the kid or they won't get there.

It's like everything else in life. You have a small number who are phenomenal and get recognition, a large group who do a great job with no fanfare and another small group who get all the attention because they are idiots.

Daddy ball is here to stay ---It will never go away. While there are a few players that will be overlooked or under praised, especially in the eyes of the “other” parents, I think the good that the involved parent does far outweighs the bad. The involved parent is the backbone of youth baseball introducing the game to young kids everywhere. Like many other parents I helped coach -- I was an assistant coach when my son was 8-9-10 and then stepped off the field. Does the involved parent give their kid special treatment? Many do, some don’t, and some parents even go the other way and go out of the way to “pass over” their own kids. I never made the preferential parental treatment issue an excuse when my son was playing. I always taught him that hard work and talent were what made things happen. If I explained that there were other “excuses” for not succeeding then I’m sure he could have thought up a few of his own. Excuses are the fuel for failure.
Fungo

Keep in mind that LL is all volunteers---with no Daddy's there is no LL Same with all rec leagues

Sure there are Daddy's who know squat but think they know it all --that comes with the territory


Personally I stopped coaching my guys at the last year of LL, 12-- the guy who took over the team ended up being the HS JV coach

If I was told I couldn't coach my son after a certain age I'd have to give him to another family and then coach his team.

If respect of all the players is the same as the respect shown to the son the situation could not be better for the players and the other parents involved. The "MySon" coaches do exist but I feel they almost all fall by the wayside due to to the pressure of other parents, or the pressure from the son himself. I know there are exceptions to the rule, but they are exceptions, and for every "daddyball" situation you will also find a "bad coach" scenario.

We have to remember that league rosters come and go through the years with players who decide baseball is not for them, or do not have the physical skills. I cannot think of anyone better than a teamates dad to make them feel at home and at least give the experience a fighting chance to enjoy the sport during that time. Daddyball coaches for the most part have more than a baseball interest in the team. It is not about showing up in the parking lot on game day, but it is also being part of the kids lives off the field through the life of their son. These are imprtant years of a kids life and I feel that the more hours a responsible adult that can be invoved the better.

Coaching youth baseball is much more than coaching baseball.

Don't use that broad brush again!

I think that up to high school it's OK and even in some off season leagues after that. I once put together a fall team (high schoolers) and just let the kids play, all I did was do put together the starting lineup and made some substitutions. I worked on teaching them how to read the opposing pitcher, get he pitch you wanted/expected. I let them bunt, steal or swap positions when ever they wanted. We didn't win all the games but we won enough to have fun.

Caveat - Daddy balls OK if it's not all about "his" son, it's about the game. I've seen many Daddy coaches who were good enough to coach at other levels but chose a business career instead.


Oh I did know one Travel/Select team where the coaches son seldom played.

My husband and a middle school coach coached their son’s teams from t-ball through age 13. I can honestly say out of the 9 years my husband coached he was only approached once by a parent because her son was not on the field for the whole game like my son was. My husband told her “if you want this job you can have it, but I must warn you, it doesn’t pay well and if you can’t tell the difference between my son and yours, I’m sorry”. All of these boys were blessed to have these two men coach them for 9 years of rec ball and 3 summers of tournament ball. These dad’s are both very knowledgeable of the game and were both great high school players. They taught these boys the game of baseball and also respect and discipline (a lot of it). Believe me when I say my husband did no favors for my son, he was a lot harder on my son then any other player. My son was on the field because he had talent and worked his rump off. He is now a high school sophomore starting pitcher and plays second or wherever he is needed. I would not have had it any other way.

I wish I had more dads in my community like you guys. If I did I would have players coming into HS that knew was a primary lead was and a secondary lead. The dads that know the game that take the time to coach these young have no idea how much they are helping these players. Too many times kids get taught the wrong way to do things by some guy who could careless. Dads that know the game and take a vested interest in making sure that the kids are taught properly help way more than the once in awhile daddyball nutcase scenario. RZ that was a great post. You should continue to do what you love and why the hell not? There are a ton of baseball guys that just happen to have sons that can out coach alot of HS baseball coaches. Some of the best coaches I know are guys that played in HS maybe some college or pro ball and just want to share the knowledge they have. Here is what I believe. When you have a dad coaching at the youth level and he has a son on the team. If this dad knows the game he is going to make sure that the players are taught properly because he darn sure wants his kid to be taught properly. If your son gets the benefit of getting taught properly because of this what is wrong with that? Would you rather have some clown come coach the team that does not have a son on the team just for the sake of him not having a son on the team? Dads are the backbone of any strong rec or travel baseball program at the youth level. And sometimes in the summer or fall at the HS level. The areas of our state that are strong in baseball all have this in common. I honestly get tired of hearing daddyball. If your sick of daddyball then you coach a team and teach them the proper way to play the game. And then you deal with the issues of everyone saying the only reason your son plays is because your the coach. How many parents of the kids playing all the time complain of daddyball? Who cares if the coaches son at 11 years old is playing SS or pitching or hitting in the 3 hole. Does it really matter as long as your son is learning the game the right way and having fun? Or are you making it miserable for him by you constantly complaining and changing teams. Be carefull because those little guys will start being the ones complaining and finding the same excuses that you are leaving on the floor for them to pick up.

Good post Coach...From what I see on LI the towns that have better LL programs generally have the stronger HS programs. No coincidence as LL is basically the feeding ground for the local area HS.

As someone who coaches his own son, I have run up against this.

What I have done to try to manage things is to...

1. Try to make sure that, as long as guys show up at practice, they get roughly equal amounts of playing time.

2. Be really objective about things when I can.

For example, when putting together the batting order for a game, I order things by each player's On Base Percentage during the previous game. The higher their OBP in the previous game, the higher they bat. In terms of calculating OBP, I count hits, BBs, and HBPs as equal (but I use hits and number of bases to break ties).

I came up with this after another parent used his "gut feeling" based approach to bat his son higher in the order than my son, despite my son's higher OBP.

Oh, and Money Ball is about as far from Daddy Ball as you can get (and that's the point).

I think I’ve posted this in the past, but the year before it was time for my son to start playing LL another dad and I went to the field and saw a lot of chaos from almost every team. No offense to the other “daddy ball” coaches, as they were doing the best they knew how, but we looked at each other and said we couldn’t leave our kids to this and became “daddy ball” coaches. We were determined to teach them the game as best we knew and to make it fun for the whole team.

League rules stipulated that each player must play a minimum of three defensive outs and have at least one at bat. Although sometimes it was a logistical nightmare, we rotated kids every inning (to many different positions) and batted the whole lineup which was allowed in our league. We kept our roster to 11 or 12 players. Also if the #9 hitter made the last out of the game, the #10 hitter led off the next game which made for some interesting lineups (slowest kid hitting leadoff, weakest hitter hitting cleanup, etc…). Needless to say we didn’t have any parent problems. Fortunately most of the kids were equal in talent so it wasn’t too traumatic. We took our lumps in the early years by playing up, but their last year together as 14 yo; we won the league by going 24-0. Unfortunately we had to alter things for tournaments as we couldn’t hit everyone and rotate defensively, but still won a couple tourneys and ended up 2nd in CABA state tourney losing to a select travel team from Denver in extra innings.

The next year as freshmen their coach correctly guessed who we had previously coached and thanked us for teaching them the game.

So, while I don’t really care for the phrase “daddy ball”, I’m glad I was one and agree with the other posters who say without us types; a lot of kids would be out of luck and out of baseball.

JMO

Also to answer the initial question; when they became freshmen and could play legion ball was the time for me to quit “officially” coaching my son.

quote:

I can honestly say out of the 9 years my husband coached he was only approached once by a parent

I was approached once by a younger single mom after a game. I didn't know her real well and initially was concerned what her problem was. She pulled me off to the side and eye-2-eye asked me what I had going for the weekend. Being a "guy" my initial thought was confused/bewildered/ and felt for once in my life like a "stud-muffin" who had to break a heart. Without skipping a beat she knocked me back down to earth saying that her and her boyfriend wanted to get away and asked if I wouldn't mind watching her son for the weekend. After I recovered from my bubble being popped I realized that I was always going to always have 12-15 kids a summer, it was by my choosing, and I wouldn't change it for anything.

This is a great thread because many have a preconceived opinion on the topic. This is when you either try to walk in those shoes, be supportive and helpful to make the situation work, or sit back watch the game and keep your mouth....... "positive". Youth baseball can have daddyball up and down the fence with moms/dads helping out in many facets of a program, not just on the bench. My advice would be just get involved and don't make "daddyball" a dirty word. If there is a message that we as parents of older kids should share, that is it. In youth baseball the strength of a program is as strong as the parents behind it and that strength filters on to the next levels.

as tr said most LL coaches are dads and without them there wouldn't be leagues.and if i didn't have kids i probably wouldn't have got involved. i coached my oldest untill 12, my youngest untill 15. i wouldn't trade that time for anything. like obrady i have put together a fall team for the last 9 years, to keep them playing, all of them. in the begining i did it for my kids but i really enjoy all the kids. i think it keeps us grounded to listen to kids other than your own, really listen they aren't telling you things because you want to here them. the local babe ruth league needs coaches,after thinking about how much fun i had i think i'll sign up for another tour.

Interesting subject. My son had five head coaches from t-ball to 11-12 LL. Not one of the coaches son's is still playing baseball. Almost without exception the coaches kid got to play more and were selected to All-Star Teams because of dad. Once the kids went to 90ft bases they had different coaches and could not compete.

Inspite of all this my son continued to play and improve and is going to a D1 school next year.

Baseball is really a layering on sport. Daddy ball really does an injustice to kids that love the game but are late bloomers. Most end up quitting by 12-13yo.

quote:

Originally posted by wildthingking:
Interesting subject. My son had five head coaches from t-ball to 11-12 LL. Not one of the coaches son's is still playing baseball. Almost without exception the coaches kid got to play more and were selected to All-Star Teams because of dad. Once the kids went to 90ft bases they had different coaches and could not compete.
Without being negative
1. Where were you?
2. Very seldom do you find a coach in the t-ball to 11/12 that do not have a son involved
3. The all-star teams diss of non-coaches kids is a program issue that should be voiced with the at large parent groups and those that speak up
4. IMHO very few all-stars fail to compete when they head to the big diamond. My guess is that you lost the coaches kids before that diamond switch.

Inspite of all this my son continued to play and improve and is going to a D1 school next year.
Did you ever wonder that maybe his "intestinal fortitude" to succeed because of the said injustices made him the player he is today.

Baseball is really a layering on sport. Daddy ball really does an injustice to kids that love the game but are late bloomers. Most end up quitting by 12-13yo.
Most end up quitting at that age regardless. I feel that most dads will give a kid with lesser tools a better shake than a guy that is just there to coach.

I am new to this site, but have been lurking for quite a while, this is a great site and one of the few times that I have disagreed with the consensus, so I thought I would throw my two cents in.

I have four boys, I have coached, have a great appreciation for those that do and up until recently always believed that a little parental bias is fairly harmless.

HS tryouts finished up two weeks ago and my oldest (sophomore) made the varsity for his second year. Two sophomore boys who I thought should have been there with him were not, both were picked over my son for the higher level all star team as 14 yr olds and both have a lot of talent. Unfortunately, both of these boys for the second straight year performed horribly during tryouts, 2 days and neither fielded or hit anywhere near to the level they are capable of (reported by my son who is friends with these boys). The problem is neither has ever had to really try out before, they have never been one bad outing as a pitcher away from dropping out of the rotation, or one bad at bat away from becoming a bench player and while both have highly developed physical skills, the pressure of having to perform in an unforgiving environment seems to have overwhelmed them (at least that is my theory). What do you think, is it possible to produce a comfort zone as a dad that can harm your kids ability to handle pressure?

Ranger welcome to the HSBBW.
With 4 boys you are a busy man.

Player's need to get out of there comfort zone.
Feel the pressure and survive, to play another game.
Because that's all it is, A Game.
Just keep playing hard with your head up.

When I hear the term “Daddy Ball” I think father favoring his son and son’s friends in an unfair manner.

But just because a Dad is the coach, it doesn’t always mean it’s “Daddy Ball”! And we should all give a big thank you to all those great dads out there who have unselfishly done so much for so many young boys in youth baseball. I’ve known a lot of dads who did a great job of coaching. Have seen a few of the other types, too.

It's too bad that some of the best dads who coach, stop coaching so soon.

Welcome to the board Ranger. Its also nice to see another NC guy on here! Dads that coach because they want to gain an advantage for their son are not doing their kid any favors in the long run. Coach because you want to coach all the kids. Coach because you have something to give to all the kids. Coach because you love the game and want to teach the game. We have all seen the dad that starts the team so his son can be assured of playing time. We all know that he is not helping his son. But in my opinion the ones that coach for the right reasons far and away out number the others.

PG, I loved coaching the kid's and my son.

But for my son's sake, I needed to stop coaching him after 12 yrs old.
And I'm glad I did.

It's his game not mine.


But it sure was Fun, when I did coach.
Even with all the Headache's of making everything fair at that age. Not counting trying to make the parent's happy.
Which never did happen with some?
Ever the Diplomat?

Just play the game, Nothing else matter's at that age.
EH

My son's daddy stopped coaching him at 9-10. It was a good decision.

I have no problem if a coach dad wants to play his son at any position, that's his payback, whether the son is deserving of the position or not. As long as that coach was a good coach, didn't use up his arm and treated his kids well we had no issues. I think the parents who really had issues with that were the ones whose sons wouldn't be playing that position anyway. Most of the coaches my son had when he was older, didn't use their sons as much as the dads did when kids were younger.

I do want to thank all of those dad's who do take their time to give to others.

I have received a few posts from some of the dads here who have coached some of the Clemson players that attend or will be attending. They are really proud of those boys and the way I see it, they have to be great coaches to turn out such great players!

Ranger you have a pm

Ever want to get a ton of kids to come to your HS age summer team try-outs?

Advertise like this:
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Summer team looking for players for college showcase team.

Team is coached by former college BB players.

NO Dad coaches.

12 man roster.

P.S. We're sponsored.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Watch what happens

Rz1-w/o being negative:

You wrote: Without being negative
1. Where were you?
2. Very seldom do you find a coach in the t-ball to 11/12 that do not have a son involved
3. The all-star teams diss of non-coaches kids is a program issue that should be voiced with the at large parent groups and those that speak up
4. IMHO very few all-stars fail to compete when they head to the big diamond. My guess is that you lost the coaches kids before that diamond switch.

1)I was at as many games and practices as possible. I did field work, ran snack bars and umpired. My schedule did not allow me to coach except occasionally.
2)Yes and they selected their kids who were less talented than other kids. So you think that all those coaches from all the other teams that selected their kids didn't support another coach selecting his kid? Come on!
3)That is LL! They don't develop kids. It's all geared to the LLWS.
4)My son did make All Stars as a 12yo. My son and one other kid are still playing baseball. Neither had daddy as a coach.

Sorry, but I allowed the coaches to make there own decisions. My son once complained about not playing more and I told him to practice more and get better. I told him if he was that much better than everyone else they would have to play him.

Gee, if your kid loves baseball and you can coach then do it. I wish I could have done it more. But if I was a coach and there was someone better than him on the team then my son would have been the one sitting.

By the way, my son did use the lack of recognition as part of his drive and incentive to succeed.

If the team would not exist without the dad, then it should never stop, derisive term withstanding. If the dad is not a good coach because he favors his son, then the other players can leave and the problem is solved.

Daddyball is defined this way to me. Dad plays his kid more than other kids on the team inspite of the fact that said kid has inferior talent and desire.

Daddyball does not mean dad's that coach and are fair to all and play their best talent.

My son has had great coaches with their son's on the team and the son was treated like everyone else.

wildthingking - You have described a very common situation. Why does it seem that when coach's kids are no good they play second base? (no disrespect intended to all you second baseman out there) Our son reacted like yours when victimized by Daddyball. I believe the vast majority of Dads do their best but a few are toxic. Your hands-on approach and involvement kept your kid on an even plane. In the end, the creme rises to the top. Congrats.

Daddy ball is good for a long, long time.

Especially if your son can "play".

Moreover, without dads, most Little Leagues would fold. Simple as that.

Dads are good. Moms are good. Sons are good. Daughters are good.

You're on a roll Been!

Dads, moms, sons, daughters, all of 'em good!

What's your take on these Been?

Acorns...good or bad?

How about bald tires...good or bad?

Chimney sweeps...good or bad?

And Drive-In Movies...good or bad?

Dare I ask about karma?

Daddy ball isn't good for anyone. Especially the son. My son is a catcher and played on a travel team where the coach's son wanted to play catcher. Whenever he was in some parents would ask why my son wasn't catching. I just said I don't know, I'm not the coach. And the pitchers wanted him to catch. Now that coach's son isn't playing ball anymore and hasn't in some time. My son is the starting catcher at a 5A school with a D1 offer. Did that kids father do him any favors? No. He only did himself a favor. What daddy ball does is give a lot of kids unrealalistic opinions of their ability. When they get to a point in their life where daddy can't do it for them, it's a hugh shock. I've seen it so many times where the dad is coaching a travel ball team and they get to high school and guess what, little Johnny is the best player now, is he.