Collegiate Summer Ball 2014 Winding Down

Great subject Swamp.

While I think that every college player should play summer ball at least once, I don’t think many realize it might be better to tell their coaches they would prefer not to. As Swamp pointed out summer ball is a long grind, it wears players down and most don’t have the time or energy to work out and get bigger and stronger. Depending on the individual, I think spending the time working out and gaining strength sometimes trumps getting worn down by the grind of summer ball. Pitchers who have logged a lot of innings should stay home and recover IMO and it may also be better for younger players to spend the summer getting bigger and stronger. Each situation is so unique I don’t think you can make blanket statements, but I think that some players and their parents don’t realize it may be better to not play.

My son played in the CCL after his freshmen year, pitching and hitting, which was unusual for a D3 player in a very competitive league. As Swamp mentioned, he got very tired at the end, they had to be at the field by 12PM 5-6 days per week and he usually did not get home until after 10PM. His second year he decided to work an internship, and played in a Sunday only league with mostly JC kids with a handful like him. He was able to workout everyday at the gym and get in his arm strength work.  He was also working on changing his pitching mechanics with his college coach so he would get video posted of his Sunday outings and he and the coach would review once a week. It ended up being the perfect scenario for him, he came back throwing significantly harder than when he left.  This year he is at UT Austin doing summer research and is doing the same thing working out in the gym, working on his arm strength and will come back to school bigger stronger and throwing harder than he would have if he had been through the summer ball grind.

Also a lot of players don’t realize but in some of the higher end leagues you can get short contracts that are 2-3 weeks and this is also a good option for players who want to be seen, but don’t want to have the long season grind.

The experiences are unforgettable and if you are invited to play in the Cape you have to go, but for many it might be better to stay home for a summer or two.   

"This is a true story" - another reason to play summer college baseball.

During my years in the old Basin League [South Dakota] we were fortunate to play in a College League. There were only 4 summer league opportunities.

The season was not long enough, in the playoffs our team Watertown Lake Sox with Dick Howser and Ron Perranoski defeated Bob Gibson Chamberlain Chiefs.

Seven months later in the Big Ten final Championship game in East Lansing. The 3b from Ohio State who I played against in South Dakota talk to the pitcher from Ohio State with instructions of how to pitch to me.

Because of the summer experience to learn pitchers and patterns, I was succesful

that day with 2 HR's and the opportunity to play in the College WS.

"Learn from each game". Keep a book!

Bob

Who's funding these summer collegiate teams? what is the responsibility of the player? Do the host families get compensation or is it out of the kindness of their hearts? Just curious.

Depends on the league and even the teams in the league. Last year we paid a fee for the summer. This year there was no cost. Both leagues are well respected. 

Funding is different from team to team. My sons team this year did not charge admission to the games. All all the coscesion money went to the schriners. They hold a camp for kids in the community that they charge a small fee for. I have assume they get there funding through local business advertizing and sponsor ships. The host families did for the most part as a community effort. The host family doesn't get season tickets because games are free. The host families for my son has been a god send. They were his family for the sumner and they may turn into life long relationships.

His team last year was funded concessions, players fees and admissions.  The year before my son played for the team it was funded by one board member. He donated a larfe sum every season, and what was left over was donated to the united way, as profits for the season. 

The leagues my son played in were non profit.margins Only one team had beer sales. Each teams have there own business model. Most leagues are about the players, but a few can be a bit shady. Teams will start recruiting for rv next year shortly. 

 Edit: Sorry for teh bad grammar and mis-spellings. I should never try to respond on a smartphone. When I have more time I will clean it up.

Thank You for the info.  Our son is a senior this upcoming year and headed to Furman next fall to start his collegiate career. Was just curious how it all worked.

This is very good info. For those that experienced it, please keep telling the stories. My son is headed off to college in a couple weeks. When should he talk to his coach about this?

As an FYI, there is a relatively local summer team that started this summer (35 minutes from home). We were at a summer ball tournament at thier place (they played at Wittenberg College in Ohio). One of the players said they stayed in the dorms this summer and had thier own room. I didn't know if this was a common practice.

Chef,

Your son should broach it with his coach not long after he gets to campus. Teams have already started recruiting teams for next year. I know coaches are already reaching out to summer teams for next year as well. 

You must be speaking of the new team in Springfield. They are a new/transferred team. they were set up on relatively short notice. last year. They may not have had time to set up host families. I have known teams to set up players in Dorm rooms. I believe when the Settlers of the Great Lakes league started out in Granville, at Denison University they initially set up players in Denison's Dorm. Believe me that must have been an uncomfortable experience. Being in a dorm room in Ohio, in the summer, with out AC must have been miserable. But they eventually were able to get Host families. As the team builds relationships in communities they usually get host families and other support for the athletes.

But that brings up another point. Teams do not only want good Baseball players they also want good people. As I stated earlier, most of the teams rely on community support. A few bad apples can ruin years of work a teams builds within a community. I know of a team that lost many of their host families from earlier years due to the behavior of the players they brought in. They struggled the following year to find places to house players and they had to rely on a motel and rental housing for many of their players. Many of the schools that were re-presented on that roster in the past are no longer there. Many of these young men will be on there own in an others home for the first time and they need to understand how to behave and not bow to peer pressure.  

Thanks Bishop. it is the new team in Springfield. They approached our summer coach looking for local players for next year and he gave them my son and another player. They, also, have a connection with Wright State I am assuming since they have a player from there already. I will have him tallk to colege coach soon about that.

we were told this league is "better" than the great lakes league. Is that true? How do leagues get rated? I know the Cape is #1 but how do leagues get the "quality" of player they are looking for and how does a player know where tehy stack up?

I can see needing good people as well as players, I can, also, see why a team would want some local players because then housing would not be an issue.

BOF, you make a very good point about playing versus conditioning and resting. Who makes that call, coach or player?

Chefmike;

Have you son open a conversation with his new college coach ASAP.

This will provide direction for next summer and additional info on the his perception of the quality of summer leagues. The Northwoods League is "outstanding".  The team franchise sells for $1 million each team.

The Virginia Valley League is also very good.

Do you know the coaches at Youngstown State?

Bob

Thanks Bob. i will have him get on that next week (he is on vacation with GF family this week, long way from home ). He has his physical next Monday and starts working out voluntarily with team Tuesday. One fo the advanatages of living so close to colege, half the freshman live close (within an hour) and half do not. those close were invited after phyiscal to come work out with upperclassmen at campus

He (my son) talked to a youngstown coach early in the process, but I personally do not know any of them.  

It is always tough to rank leagues. A lot of it depends on your goals and skills. From a purely talent perspective you cannot beat the Cape, as you pointed out, The talent there is top notch. I am not sure that a player that needs a good bit of development fits there, so in that case that would not be a good fit. If your son is a good pitcher and his coach wants him on an innings count, the leagues that play more games may not be a good fit. The NACSB I think for the most part are around forty games Other leagues have upward of 60. The leagues that play 60 might not be a good fit for a good pitcher on an inning count, because he may end up with quite a few more innings than expected, especially if he gets W's.Coaches want to send players to leagues where they will develop and be successful. Whether That's the Prospect league or Great Lake League in our area, the best league is the one with the best fit.

That being said, Perfect Game ranks the leagues based on prospects. You can see the ranking here. 

http://www.perfectgame.org/sum...legiate/default.aspx

Good luck, This is my son's last summer of Collegiate Wood bat baseball. It goes fast, enjoy it. A poster on here gave me some very good advice: "While the league close to you may not have the best reputation, It is sure nice to be able to see your son play." That was the year he played in the Great Lakes league. I saw almost every game, home and away. This year he is playing 6 hours away and I made a very nice trip, and met a lot of nice people, there has not been much baseball for me this summer. I can tell you I miss seeing him play. 

I guess it boils down to finding the right fit. 

Just a few tidbits derived from my nonpaying job as a summer league GM:

1. Most leagues either charge a fee or will be charging a fee. I dislike player fees but it was approved for our league (Valley) in 2015 to charge a $200 fee. It's purely a financial survival issue for most teams in the NACSB.

2. Leagues with for-profit owners run them as a business, which they are, and they play a LOT of games. By year end some of those teams list more than 30 pitchers that have thrown. 70+ games is not unusual.

3. "Ranking" leagues is always debatable and often purely arbitrary. MLB scouts talk to us, tell us they like our league a lot, and we see them at games. Not as often as 10 years ago but the world of scouting has changed. If the MLB scouts are coming, your league has talent.

4. Your biggest venues and stadiums are more likely for profit teams, but not always .Our league has several teams in towns with populations in the 2500-5000 range so you won't see crowds of 2,000 but fans get really attached really quickly to their players and these guys get treated wonderfully all summer long. (our town population is around 6,000 and we run somewhere in the 300-400 range, with 600+ in playoffs).

5. Go to a league where you will play. Nobody learns by sitting. When we recruit, we look at stats from previous summers and a good year in a "lesser" league can attract a better offer the next year.

6. Freshman position players are hard to place if not at a well-known school. Pitchers are easier-93 is 93 everywhere. Two of our drafted players last year were D-3 pitchers.

7. By summer's end, all of these guys are ready to go home. We're in playoffs right now and our season will end within a week or so.  Our guys say the right things to the press...but they will be very glad to get home for 2-3 weeks before starting school again. Summer moms and dads are wonderful and relationships can last a lifetime with hosts...but momma's home cooking and loving is hard to top.

My son, a RHP,  had a brief stint with the Prospect league last year. We have a local team, stadium is 15 minutes from our house. He joined the team for approx.. 1 month and after only 2 appearances and 2 IP he decided to go back to his local adult men’s league and get some additional innings. He is the one that approached the coach and told him he enjoyed his time with the team but he needed to get some work in, they parted on good terms.

This year he was approached by another team in the Prospect league that would have required him to live out of town. We looked at their 1^st half schedule, calculated the travel hours and declined. He would have spent approx.. 60+ hours on a bus in the 1^st month. Sleeping in your own bed and eating mom's food is tough to pass up. He opted for a more local collegiate wood bat http://www.tsclb.com/      league that played less games, 1 mid week game and double headers on Saturday and Sunday. Being a pitcher he was only required to be there the day he pitched. This league cost us $300 to participate.  This worked out great for him as he was able to work out and also had a part time job. ( plus kept my grass mowed). He probably approached 40 innings with that team.  They wrapped up their season last week.

He has again joined the local team in the Prospect league. Pitchers are constantly in demand in these leagues, some get shut down by their college coaches, others get hurt, etc.  He will probably finish out the year coming out of the pen. There is no player cost involved with the Prospect league.  They play a 60 game schedule with playoffs at the end of the season. The out of town players stay with host families, the majority of which have remained the same over the years. Our neighbors have hosted players for the last 3-4 years. The reward is season tickets for the host family. NCAA regulations don’t permit free tickets to the local kid’s families. So my cost there is purchasing tickets and enjoying the icy cold $3.00 Labatt’s drafts!

His local team consisted of similar talent as the Prospect League, both have a collection of D-1 through JC players. The players could possibly be exchanged and the records might not change a lot. But I only went to watch the 1^st league when my son pitched and have only been to a handful of Prospect league games this season…

The biggest difference is the atmosphere, Prospect league games have a minor league game feel. Crowds have been 4-600 range, The 1^st game my son pitched in was fireworks night so there were over 1,200 in the crowd. The other league was lucky to have 50-75 people at games.  PA announcers, between inning contest, music,  etc. make the games entertaining. I think my son enjoys that as much as the ball game.

It is a grind for the players, after long college seasons many are ready for a break. The Prospect league has some long bus rides. Since last year after the Slippery Rock, Pa team was relocated to Ill. or Indiana and the divisions play each other more often the travel has really increased. Like a poster stated before the playoffs aren’t a goal for some, but I have seen nothing but 100% effort when any player hits the field.

For the recent commits, all decisions on any of his team selections have gone through his present college coach. Even on the recruiting trail you never know who you’re going to hook up with down the line. The assistant coaches for many programs are heavily involved in these summer programs, my son was recruited out of HS by coaches that have become his summer managers and coaches

Here is a great story about a kid that just joined the team my son also plays for. From intern to the mound. I got to the stadium last night in the 6^th inning.  I didn’t know this kids background until after I watched him pitch, good stuff! 

http://www.butlerbluesox.net/

One week prior to the end of PO Jr's freshman year, HC told him you are going to this team for summer ball. Wanted him to get some starts as all his 20 innings came in relief. Gets home Sunday, leave for summer team Wednesday! 6-7 hour drive. Pitches in relief opening game Friday and gets the save.

Team pays for gas to get there, apartment next to the field, some food paid for and lots of free gear. They get paid to do camps or have the opportunity to get part time job in local businesses.

Most games are at home, great fan base, 800-1600 each game. He's had time to go to the gym 5 days a week to get stronger? He has appeared in 10 games, 3 starts and will get his final start tonight. He pitched over 30 innings and should finish with 35-40.

He has also made some great friends, got to experience some of the local sights and flavors. The other day he said he was ready to come home, but wanted to stay to the end so he could get the max innings available. They play 48 games with no league play offs. This year they had no league association so that enabled them to chose who to play. They played mostly other wood bat collegiate teams, but also played some semi pro teams with guys older that had graduated and played some minor league ball. That was interesting.

He comes home this Monday the 4th and has to be back at school on the 15th. He will shut down his arm for 6-8 weeks.

Overall, I think it was a great experience for him. For me, I was only able to get to 4 games, that was hard. Luckily, most were boardcast on the Internet.

Question related to all this.  Would you all say that summer leagues are primarily for development for the next college season, or for exposure to MLB scouts?  I'm sure that there are scouts that attend Cape games, how about the other leagues?  My son played in a local summer league last summer (Sunbelt in Georgia) and this summer took off to work on mechanics and conditioning.  Considering playing at least half the summer next year, but if it is purely for development, not sure it is worth the hassle, especially if he gets a lot of inning during the regular season.

Curious as to your thoughts.

My son is close to wrapping up his 2nd season in the NWL, playing 2000 miles from home. In June he drove straight from school, arriving at 2am on a Sunday morning and playing in the game that afternoon. By my calculation he has played 40 games in 46 days. The recent few days were amazing - after playing into the evening on Tuesday, they drove for 11 hours and played Wednesday a split double header - first game in the afternoon at home followed by a 2 hour bus ride and game number 2 (both 9 inning games). He loves it and is very appreciative of how fortunate he is - he can never understand his teammates who complain about the food, the lodging, the travel - too him it's all good (I think he's listened to the old man telling him it beats working!). These summer leagues have been a great experience for him - among other things he's enjoyed success and received a lot of PT when that has not been the case at school. 

Skraps77;

What team in the Northwoods League? Great communities and outstanding experiences for your son.

How was the attendance at the games?

Bob

Waterloo Bucks. The organization is phenomenal and the fan base and community are incredibly supportive (and loyal). They get pretty good crowds, around 1,600 per game, although I know some of the other teams in the league do quite a bit better. 

It is not a real easy question to answer. The anser will be different from league to league and even from team to team in some leagues. But in the end your player will go were his coach sends him. 

My son played for the Florida Collegiate League this past summer and in 2013. Six teams, all relatively close together around Orlando. Fantastic folks. Championship game held at the Trop. I can't overstate the amount of support my son got. We will always be grateful. 

Mom,

It is good to hear. I always enjoy hearing from someone who had a positive experience.