Matt13 posted:PGStaff posted:Sure he has the right to do it and I have the right to wish he would leave the country. Maybe go somewhere where those freedoms don't exist.
What this says is, "You have the right, just don't exercise it."
I don't think it says that at all. My issue is his disrespect. I couldn't care less that he didn't stand, it is the disrespect he showed by his statement...
Not a fan of him or his recent stance.....but it is his right. Whimsical is the word i would use to describe not only his decision to do this but his career as well.
2ndMarDiv posted:I respectfully disagree on not having the same opportunities. I think we all have the same opportunities we just don't have the same opportunities to good parenting.
Oh, there are definitely different opportunities. A person's money, family, and connections can surely provide better opportunities. I will give another example:
My cousin (Mom's Sister's Daughter) has a white mother, and a Mexican father. (Father from Mexico, mother from Alabama) My cousin grew up in Atlanta where I was born and lived the younger part of my life. Since my cousin was a minority, she was bussed across the city of Atlanta to a Performing Arts School. Guess who didn't get bussed across the city of Atlanta? You guessed it the poor, white kid that was her cousin. So different opportunities do exist for different people.
Yes , there are problems here as there are problems in many other countries, but it doesnt take away from this country being great. America is not perfect but it is the best I know. Although, I would NOT have used that moment to voice my displeasure. There is one question that keeps popping in my head and continues to be unanswered by most of the media and other people who have spoken their opinion about the topic. When is a good time for a person who feels they must speak out? When would I have chosen to make my position known to the general public if I so wanted? What is the best forum?
Many people agree that he should have stood for the National Anthem. So do I . But he felt compelled to act. This actually wasnt the first time he took a stance. I checked his social media sources. I wondered why he did not say anything during the 49rs run to the Super Bowl or the countless interviews he has done. Maybe something has happened recently to make him see things in a different light.
Please remember that different races stood elbow to elbow during civil rights protests. Many of those people stood at attention during the National Anthem. It was not the forum THEY chose to voice their displeasure at the injustices they saw at that time. Some chose to stand. Some chose to NOT stand also. Americans spirit.
You can see injustice while you are wealthy or poor, regardless of race, religion, sexual orientation, or the color of your parents. The race issue in America is a complex issue and not easily solved. Some injustices are small and easily overcome. When my daughter played softball and my son played baseball for the same sports program and the softball fields were horrible and impossible to play on while the baseball fields were well kept, I stood up and voiced my opinion to force a change. ( just one example... I thought it fit in well with this website ). But we wont solve the race issue quite as easily, I am afraid. We must try to do something? It is very divisive and ugly. I dont know where I would begin to solve it. Not during pre game. Probably during post game.....maybe not even in the context of a sporting event....but I dont have the answer. I dont know WHEN.
God Bless this country, where a man is free to voice his displeasure without fear of persecution by the government. In many other countries that would not be possible. THAT is a right my family has defended and I will gladly defend. Over and over. Even if I dont agree with NOT standing for the Anthem. I will ALWAYS agree with trying to make the world and more specifically, America, a better place. I love this country.
rynoattack posted:2ndMarDiv posted:I respectfully disagree on not having the same opportunities. I think we all have the same opportunities we just don't have the same opportunities to good parenting.
Oh, there are definitely different opportunities. A person's money, family, and connections can surely provide better opportunities. I will give another example:
My cousin (Mom's Sister's Daughter) has a white mother, and a Mexican father. (Father from Mexico, mother from Alabama) My cousin grew up in Atlanta where I was born and lived the younger part of my life. Since my cousin was a minority, she was bussed across the city of Atlanta to a Performing Arts School. Guess who didn't get bussed across the city of Atlanta? You guessed it the poor, white kid that was her cousin. So different opportunities do exist for different people.
That must have been a huge school if all the hispanic, half hispanic, and I assume all other minority students in the greater Atlanta area, were bused there to the exclusion of any and all poor white kids - or rich white kids for that matter. Wait, that's probably not what really happened.
Again, if someone wants to put forward a reasonable argument, please do so. Citing Ben Carson, Herman Cain and, "if you are so inclined" Barack Obama (yea, I'll include him since he's the president of the United States) as examples proving the absence of "systematic oppression" is simply stupid (again, sort of like the VMA's). The remark about getting left out of the Performing Arts school is just as stupid. I realize this is the wrong forum to be discussing this topic in detail, but I cannot help resist in asking folks to be reasonable in their arguments. Does Brittany Spears represent the "oppressed white girl" that struggled and made it to the VMA's? Please stop citing the gross exceptions. Didn't the Yankees once send a little person to the plate to get walked? Maybe that instance should serve as inspiration for all little people to pursue a career in the MLB - sorry, that's what is known as a gross exception.
I'll stick to getting my baseball advice here. Think it's time to shut this thread down as I do not see it adding any value to the hsbaseball core.
2017LHPSCREWBALL, are you suggesting that there are so few blacks that are successful that it's not worth mentioning the several that come to mind? Do you want me to look up some statistics showing how many black people make over $50,000 per year? Or how many black people make more than what ever number of white people? There are PLENTY of blacks and other minorities who are living a very comfortable life. There are PLENTY of blacks and other minorities who have risen to positions of high management and power. I can't possibly sit here and list them all.
I'll leave it at that...
roothog66 posted:The problem isn't even the small handful of "bad" officers - the problem is actually the "good" ones. Every time a Black youth is shot and killed, the African-American community sees it as an outrage. Why? Because, so often, it is outrageous. Then what happens? The police unions and the "good" officers circle the wagons. They don't differentiate between justified shootings and basic homicide. They back their own, regardless of the circumstances.
I don't really see this as the case. What the "good" cops usually do is say "Let's investigate and find out what really happened". They don't jump to the conclusion that the cop is guilty or that the victim was guilty. That's the way it should be on both sides. There have been plenty of cops prosecuted and convicted for going over the line and committing a crime while wearing the uniform. There have been plenty acquitted. Everyone is too quick to judge these days...
2017LHPscrewball posted:rynoattack posted:2ndMarDiv posted:I respectfully disagree on not having the same opportunities. I think we all have the same opportunities we just don't have the same opportunities to good parenting.
Oh, there are definitely different opportunities. A person's money, family, and connections can surely provide better opportunities. I will give another example:
My cousin (Mom's Sister's Daughter) has a white mother, and a Mexican father. (Father from Mexico, mother from Alabama) My cousin grew up in Atlanta where I was born and lived the younger part of my life. Since my cousin was a minority, she was bussed across the city of Atlanta to a Performing Arts School. Guess who didn't get bussed across the city of Atlanta? You guessed it the poor, white kid that was her cousin. So different opportunities do exist for different people.
That must have been a huge school if all the hispanic, half hispanic, and I assume all other minority students in the greater Atlanta area, were bused there to the exclusion of any and all poor white kids - or rich white kids for that matter. Wait, that's probably not what really happened.
Again, if someone wants to put forward a reasonable argument, please do so. Citing Ben Carson, Herman Cain and, "if you are so inclined" Barack Obama (yea, I'll include him since he's the president of the United States) as examples proving the absence of "systematic oppression" is simply stupid (again, sort of like the VMA's). The remark about getting left out of the Performing Arts school is just as stupid. I realize this is the wrong forum to be discussing this topic in detail, but I cannot help resist in asking folks to be reasonable in their arguments. Does Brittany Spears represent the "oppressed white girl" that struggled and made it to the VMA's? Please stop citing the gross exceptions. Didn't the Yankees once send a little person to the plate to get walked? Maybe that instance should serve as inspiration for all little people to pursue a career in the MLB - sorry, that's what is known as a gross exception.
I'll stick to getting my baseball advice here. Think it's time to shut this thread down as I do not see it adding any value to the hsbaseball core.
I believe that was the St. Louis Browns, when they were owned by Veeck.
I think it can be boiled down to respect, or lack there of. I have the right to go over the my mother's house and not use coasters like she likes, not agree to eat what she has prepared because I don't like it, and not park where she has asked me to park a million times....but it's her house and that's just rude. I use the coasters, I park where she has asked me to park and I pick at the meal and tell her I had a BIG lunch but everything looks great.
When you are in America you have the right to not stand or sing the national anthem, but it's just rude not to.
BBALLMAN - please stop digging - the hole you are digging is already big enough. As for quoting, yes, please quote me statistics, maybe income levels, family wealth, poverty levels, etc. Then maybe start quoting some more nuanced statistics like incarceration rates, homicide rates, life expectancy, education levels. You could mention 1,000 by name - I assume that would meet your definition of "PLENTY". But again, that short list of names (given the US population) does not prove anything. While you are at it, please give me your definition of "PLENTY".
I love your quote " I can't possibly sit here and list them all." - priceless.
My bad on the Yankees reference - should have done my homework. Thanks BISHOP for the correction.
Neither the flag nor the anthem is about anyone personally. Sitting during the anthem is disrespectful to all those that came before him, both living and dead that helped get this country to where it is today, imperfect, a work in progress, but our country.
bballman posted:roothog66 posted:The problem isn't even the small handful of "bad" officers - the problem is actually the "good" ones. Every time a Black youth is shot and killed, the African-American community sees it as an outrage. Why? Because, so often, it is outrageous. Then what happens? The police unions and the "good" officers circle the wagons. They don't differentiate between justified shootings and basic homicide. They back their own, regardless of the circumstances.I don't really see this as the case. What the "good" cops usually do is say "Let's investigate and find out what really happened". They don't jump to the conclusion that the cop is guilty or that the victim was guilty. That's the way it should be on both sides. There have been plenty of cops prosecuted and convicted for going over the line and committing a crime while wearing the uniform. There have been plenty acquitted. Everyone is too quick to judge these days...
I disagree. When the FOP's annual meeting refers to "our brothers in Ferguson" (you know, the ones that were found to have been systemically extorting minorities,) that belies your point.
CaCO3Girl posted:When you are in America you have the right to not stand or sing the national anthem, but it's just rude not to.
No, it's not. Do you think it's rude of me to refuse to say the Pledge of Allegiance?
Matt13 posted:CaCO3Girl posted:When you are in America you have the right to not stand or sing the national anthem, but it's just rude not to.
No, it's not. Do you think it's rude of me to refuse to say the Pledge of Allegiance?
I fought for this country. I'd find it disrespectful if you sat down during the national anthem. Respect your country and those that have given their lives for your freedom to choose. If you have a position, at least be selective when you're going to make a statement.
Please close this thread, it's intolerable to listen to anything more.
I think I'm going back to my original statement that I'm going to leave this alone now, being it's on a baseball website. Maybe there's a good politics website somewhere we can debate this...
2017LHPscrewball posted:rynoattack posted:2ndMarDiv posted:I respectfully disagree on not having the same opportunities. I think we all have the same opportunities we just don't have the same opportunities to good parenting.
Oh, there are definitely different opportunities. A person's money, family, and connections can surely provide better opportunities. I will give another example:
My cousin (Mom's Sister's Daughter) has a white mother, and a Mexican father. (Father from Mexico, mother from Alabama) My cousin grew up in Atlanta where I was born and lived the younger part of my life. Since my cousin was a minority, she was bussed across the city of Atlanta to a Performing Arts School. Guess who didn't get bussed across the city of Atlanta? You guessed it the poor, white kid that was her cousin. So different opportunities do exist for different people.
That must have been a huge school if all the hispanic, half hispanic, and I assume all other minority students in the greater Atlanta area, were bused there to the exclusion of any and all poor white kids - or rich white kids for that matter. Wait, that's probably not what really happened.
Again, if someone wants to put forward a reasonable argument, please do so. Citing Ben Carson, Herman Cain and, "if you are so inclined" Barack Obama (yea, I'll include him since he's the president of the United States) as examples proving the absence of "systematic oppression" is simply stupid (again, sort of like the VMA's). The remark about getting left out of the Performing Arts school is just as stupid. I realize this is the wrong forum to be discussing this topic in detail, but I cannot help resist in asking folks to be reasonable in their arguments. Does Brittany Spears represent the "oppressed white girl" that struggled and made it to the VMA's? Please stop citing the gross exceptions. Didn't the Yankees once send a little person to the plate to get walked? Maybe that instance should serve as inspiration for all little people to pursue a career in the MLB - sorry, that's what is known as a gross exception.
I'll stick to getting my baseball advice here. Think it's time to shut this thread down as I do not see it adding any value to the hsbaseball core.
Yeah, you're completely right. I just made that story up...
Gov posted:Matt13 posted:CaCO3Girl posted:When you are in America you have the right to not stand or sing the national anthem, but it's just rude not to.
No, it's not. Do you think it's rude of me to refuse to say the Pledge of Allegiance?
I fought for this country. I'd find it disrespectful if you sat down during the national anthem. Respect your country and those that have given their lives for your freedom to choose. If you have a position, at least be selective when you're going to make a statement.
So did I (still do.) I don't think you understand what we fight for.
2017LHPscrewball posted:rynoattack posted:2ndMarDiv posted:I respectfully disagree on not having the same opportunities. I think we all have the same opportunities we just don't have the same opportunities to good parenting.
Oh, there are definitely different opportunities. A person's money, family, and connections can surely provide better opportunities. I will give another example:
My cousin (Mom's Sister's Daughter) has a white mother, and a Mexican father. (Father from Mexico, mother from Alabama) My cousin grew up in Atlanta where I was born and lived the younger part of my life. Since my cousin was a minority, she was bussed across the city of Atlanta to a Performing Arts School. Guess who didn't get bussed across the city of Atlanta? You guessed it the poor, white kid that was her cousin. So different opportunities do exist for different people.
That must have been a huge school if all the hispanic, half hispanic, and I assume all other minority students in the greater Atlanta area, were bused there to the exclusion of any and all poor white kids - or rich white kids for that matter. Wait, that's probably not what really happened.
Again, if someone wants to put forward a reasonable argument, please do so. Citing Ben Carson, Herman Cain and, "if you are so inclined" Barack Obama (yea, I'll include him since he's the president of the United States) as examples proving the absence of "systematic oppression" is simply stupid (again, sort of like the VMA's). The remark about getting left out of the Performing Arts school is just as stupid. I realize this is the wrong forum to be discussing this topic in detail, but I cannot help resist in asking folks to be reasonable in their arguments. Does Brittany Spears represent the "oppressed white girl" that struggled and made it to the VMA's? Please stop citing the gross exceptions. Didn't the Yankees once send a little person to the plate to get walked? Maybe that instance should serve as inspiration for all little people to pursue a career in the MLB - sorry, that's what is known as a gross exception.
I'll stick to getting my baseball advice here. Think it's time to shut this thread down as I do not see it adding any value to the hsbaseball core.
Maybe you should do a little research to find if minorities are afforded more opportunities for schooling than less fortunate white kids are. Have you ever heard of Affirmative Action??
rynoattack posted:2017LHPscrewball posted:rynoattack posted:2ndMarDiv posted:I respectfully disagree on not having the same opportunities. I think we all have the same opportunities we just don't have the same opportunities to good parenting.
Oh, there are definitely different opportunities. A person's money, family, and connections can surely provide better opportunities. I will give another example:
My cousin (Mom's Sister's Daughter) has a white mother, and a Mexican father. (Father from Mexico, mother from Alabama) My cousin grew up in Atlanta where I was born and lived the younger part of my life. Since my cousin was a minority, she was bussed across the city of Atlanta to a Performing Arts School. Guess who didn't get bussed across the city of Atlanta? You guessed it the poor, white kid that was her cousin. So different opportunities do exist for different people.
That must have been a huge school if all the hispanic, half hispanic, and I assume all other minority students in the greater Atlanta area, were bused there to the exclusion of any and all poor white kids - or rich white kids for that matter. Wait, that's probably not what really happened.
Again, if someone wants to put forward a reasonable argument, please do so. Citing Ben Carson, Herman Cain and, "if you are so inclined" Barack Obama (yea, I'll include him since he's the president of the United States) as examples proving the absence of "systematic oppression" is simply stupid (again, sort of like the VMA's). The remark about getting left out of the Performing Arts school is just as stupid. I realize this is the wrong forum to be discussing this topic in detail, but I cannot help resist in asking folks to be reasonable in their arguments. Does Brittany Spears represent the "oppressed white girl" that struggled and made it to the VMA's? Please stop citing the gross exceptions. Didn't the Yankees once send a little person to the plate to get walked? Maybe that instance should serve as inspiration for all little people to pursue a career in the MLB - sorry, that's what is known as a gross exception.
I'll stick to getting my baseball advice here. Think it's time to shut this thread down as I do not see it adding any value to the hsbaseball core.
Yeah, you're completely right. I just made that story up...
I thought you might be exaggerating when you implied that the Performing Arts school was attended by every minority in the Atlanta area. Otherwise I would have thought you were using a single example to try and prove some larger point that was not in fact true - my bad. Again, that must have been a really big school - with a huge fleet of buses. Any famous students? Did they have an athletics program and compete in the super-size classification? I assume the graduation ceremony took the entire weekend.
I have no doubt your cousin attended that school and you did not, however using that as some type of proof for whatever argument you are trying to make is - again - stupid.
To all of those that believe he was right, make sure your kid sits out the national anthem at his next exposure tournament. Yeah! Let us know how that turns out.
2forU posted:To all of those that believe he was right, make sure your kid sits out the national anthem at his next exposure tournament. Yeah! Let us know how that turns out.
I do wish this would be shut down as I cannot seem to help myself. Yes - if your kid is aiming to get into a specific program and they show up at the showcase, stand up during the national anthem. Coaches in general do not want kids who have potential issues which could negatively impact their program. That are not going to want to explain every series why one of their guys is sitting in the dugout while everyone else is lined up. Don't blame them. They also like their guys to keep their shirts tucked in and their hats facing forward.
As for this situation when an adult - who presumably is set for life and is something of an actor on a national stage - decides to sit it out, I think that person understands what they are trying to achieve.
Putting these two situations together as though they are identical, or even somewhat similar, is not valid. If you want to point out that lots of people off the street would find sitting offensive, please proceed. I myself find it a little distasteful and maybe not the best approach (especially when he has a stage already and could make his opinions knows in a different fashion). but I really do prefer solid arguments.
I never served in the armed forces, but when those guys come forward and talk about folks' liberties, including sitting, as a right they fought for, I'm going to give them lots of credit for knowing what they are talking about.
rynoattack posted:2017LHPscrewball posted:rynoattack posted:2ndMarDiv posted:I respectfully disagree on not having the same opportunities. I think we all have the same opportunities we just don't have the same opportunities to good parenting.
Oh, there are definitely different opportunities. A person's money, family, and connections can surely provide better opportunities. I will give another example:
My cousin (Mom's Sister's Daughter) has a white mother, and a Mexican father. (Father from Mexico, mother from Alabama) My cousin grew up in Atlanta where I was born and lived the younger part of my life. Since my cousin was a minority, she was bussed across the city of Atlanta to a Performing Arts School. Guess who didn't get bussed across the city of Atlanta? You guessed it the poor, white kid that was her cousin. So different opportunities do exist for different people.
That must have been a huge school if all the hispanic, half hispanic, and I assume all other minority students in the greater Atlanta area, were bused there to the exclusion of any and all poor white kids - or rich white kids for that matter. Wait, that's probably not what really happened.
Again, if someone wants to put forward a reasonable argument, please do so. Citing Ben Carson, Herman Cain and, "if you are so inclined" Barack Obama (yea, I'll include him since he's the president of the United States) as examples proving the absence of "systematic oppression" is simply stupid (again, sort of like the VMA's). The remark about getting left out of the Performing Arts school is just as stupid. I realize this is the wrong forum to be discussing this topic in detail, but I cannot help resist in asking folks to be reasonable in their arguments. Does Brittany Spears represent the "oppressed white girl" that struggled and made it to the VMA's? Please stop citing the gross exceptions. Didn't the Yankees once send a little person to the plate to get walked? Maybe that instance should serve as inspiration for all little people to pursue a career in the MLB - sorry, that's what is known as a gross exception.
I'll stick to getting my baseball advice here. Think it's time to shut this thread down as I do not see it adding any value to the hsbaseball core.
Maybe you should do a little research to find if minorities are afforded more opportunities for schooling than less fortunate white kids are. Have you ever heard of Affirmative Action??
Wow.
Swampboys gonna be ticked y'all! I see a lot of erasures in his future.
http://www.msn.com/en-us/sport...r-AAicYdy?li=BBnb7Kz
Maybe his actions have to do with his contract. How to keep $12 million after he is cut.
Bob
When the national anthem plays I always feel a sense of brotherhood. We're all out for the common good for all Americans.
This country is great, but it's having problems right now... Let's pay respect to the anthem and flag in brotherhood and trust this common bond will allow all of us to work together.
Lets get back to the healthy outlet of baseball.
Cheers to all,
David
nxt lvl posted:Yes , there are problems here as there are problems in many other countries, but it doesnt take away from this country being great. America is not perfect but it is the best I know. Although, I would NOT have used that moment to voice my displeasure. There is one question that keeps popping in my head and continues to be unanswered by most of the media and other people who have spoken their opinion about the topic. When is a good time for a person who feels they must speak out? When would I have chosen to make my position known to the general public if I so wanted? What is the best forum?
Many people agree that he should have stood for the National Anthem. So do I . But he felt compelled to act. This actually wasnt the first time he took a stance. I checked his social media sources. I wondered why he did not say anything during the 49rs run to the Super Bowl or the countless interviews he has done. Maybe something has happened recently to make him see things in a different light.
Please remember that different races stood elbow to elbow during civil rights protests. Many of those people stood at attention during the National Anthem. It was not the forum THEY chose to voice their displeasure at the injustices they saw at that time. Some chose to stand. Some chose to NOT stand also. Americans spirit.
You can see injustice while you are wealthy or poor, regardless of race, religion, sexual orientation, or the color of your parents. The race issue in America is a complex issue and not easily solved. Some injustices are small and easily overcome. When my daughter played softball and my son played baseball for the same sports program and the softball fields were horrible and impossible to play on while the baseball fields were well kept, I stood up and voiced my opinion to force a change. ( just one example... I thought it fit in well with this website ). But we wont solve the race issue quite as easily, I am afraid. We must try to do something? It is very divisive and ugly. I dont know where I would begin to solve it. Not during pre game. Probably during post game.....maybe not even in the context of a sporting event....but I dont have the answer. I dont know WHEN.
God Bless this country, where a man is free to voice his displeasure without fear of persecution by the government. In many other countries that would not be possible. THAT is a right my family has defended and I will gladly defend. Over and over. Even if I dont agree with NOT standing for the Anthem. I will ALWAYS agree with trying to make the world and more specifically, America, a better place. I love this country.
Something did occur recently. He started dating a BLM activist.
BishopLeftiesDad posted:2017LHPscrewball posted:rynoattack posted:2ndMarDiv posted:I respectfully disagree on not having the same opportunities. I think we all have the same opportunities we just don't have the same opportunities to good parenting.
Oh, there are definitely different opportunities. A person's money, family, and connections can surely provide better opportunities. I will give another example:
My cousin (Mom's Sister's Daughter) has a white mother, and a Mexican father. (Father from Mexico, mother from Alabama) My cousin grew up in Atlanta where I was born and lived the younger part of my life. Since my cousin was a minority, she was bussed across the city of Atlanta to a Performing Arts School. Guess who didn't get bussed across the city of Atlanta? You guessed it the poor, white kid that was her cousin. So different opportunities do exist for different people.
That must have been a huge school if all the hispanic, half hispanic, and I assume all other minority students in the greater Atlanta area, were bused there to the exclusion of any and all poor white kids - or rich white kids for that matter. Wait, that's probably not what really happened.
Again, if someone wants to put forward a reasonable argument, please do so. Citing Ben Carson, Herman Cain and, "if you are so inclined" Barack Obama (yea, I'll include him since he's the president of the United States) as examples proving the absence of "systematic oppression" is simply stupid (again, sort of like the VMA's). The remark about getting left out of the Performing Arts school is just as stupid. I realize this is the wrong forum to be discussing this topic in detail, but I cannot help resist in asking folks to be reasonable in their arguments. Does Brittany Spears represent the "oppressed white girl" that struggled and made it to the VMA's? Please stop citing the gross exceptions. Didn't the Yankees once send a little person to the plate to get walked? Maybe that instance should serve as inspiration for all little people to pursue a career in the MLB - sorry, that's what is known as a gross exception.
I'll stick to getting my baseball advice here. Think it's time to shut this thread down as I do not see it adding any value to the hsbaseball core.
I believe that was the St. Louis Browns, when they were owned by Veeck.
Eddie Gaedel was used by Bill Veeck's as part of his baseball circus. He had no rit to be on a MLB field.
No one made Kaepernick play in the NFL. Since he chose to take the opportunity he should respect NFL customs.
i attended a Christian private high school one year. I'm not Christian. We had prayers before every meal. We had church five days a week. I wasn't forced to pray. I was told I had to sit quietly and respectfully during the prayers. My family chose to send me there. It was on me to respect the majority.
We've all said our peace. Let's move on..
Jay Glazer usually gets it right. He's very well connected in the NFL. He said expect Kaepernick to be released before the start of the season. It's not all about the national anthem. There are many who believe he is washed up as a QB. He may have done what he did to expedite his release.
If you think it will cost him an opportunity to play NFL football, forget it. NFL teams sign criminals if they think it will help them win.
Matt13 posted:CaCO3Girl posted:When you are in America you have the right to not stand or sing the national anthem, but it's just rude not to.
No, it's not. Do you think it's rude of me to refuse to say the Pledge of Allegiance?
Yeah, I can't resist either.
When you enter or live in a country you should respect the customs of that country. If you do not want to pledge allegiance to the flag you should at least stand.
Interesting observations. I actually was outraged but after reading about the history of the Star Spangled Banner, I somewhat understand why he possibly decided NOT to stand, at some point in his lifetime.
The song written by Francis Scott Key, is not sung in its entirety, only the first verse, there are 3. The National Anthem is actually a celebration of slavery. Some feel it actually should not be our National Anthem anymore, and represents a dark period in our countrys history.
You all can google it.
However, after listening to a gold star mother today, I agree with what she said. Sometimes its not about what you do, but what you dont do. If Kaepernick felt or feels that blacks or any other race is suppressed, then do something to help make a change.
A perfect example of this is how LeBron James is helping to bring commerce back to Cleveland, which would bring jobs and more income to the area. Dwayne Wade went back to Chicago for the same reason. Many athletes do spend their off season trying to help make a difference in other peoples lives, because they understand they are truely blessed to be where they are.
So while I understand Kaepernick has the freedom to stand or not stand while they are playing the National Anthem, he also has the freedom to do something to help bring change.
JMO
Gov posted:We've all said our peace. Let's move on..
Good advise. Positions have been laid out and, strangely for an internet forum, rather civilly and with respect. I think this would be a good jumping off point to get back to baseball.
Per one of the various disagreements in this thread:
I just was listening to a veteran that had lost his legs serving our country. His take was this, he is not upset with Kapernick sitting down as much as he is with what he said afterwards. This guy said, look at the military. It has come so far with regards to officers, race, opportunity and promotions. He said that when he was at war, he had his "brothers" at his side. He didn't care about race. He said that, and I am quoting him here, "when someone speaks of oppression, do they understand the improvements since the Civil Rights movement and how far our society had come." What was tough to take was his statement that he'd give anything to stand one time for the National Anthem.
As an FYI, I've never heard nor studied that the National Anthem is a celebration of slavery. This verse is the verse that causes some to question the Star Spangled Banner:
And where is that band who so vauntingly swore
That the havoc of war and the battle's confusion,
A home and a country, should leave us no more?
Their blood has washed out their foul footsteps' pollution.
No refuge could save the hireling and slave
From the terror of flight, or the gloom of the grave:
And the star-spangled banner in triumph doth wave,
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave.
The reference to, "No refuge could save the hireling and slave." is a reference the British freeing slaves and hiring others in the colonies to join their army as the marched on Washington D.C. to burn it. Thus the emotion of the verse since Washington D.C. was burned. The references today are either taken totally out of context on purpose or people are ignorant of what transpired as Washington D.C. burned.
I had a very energetic music teacher in elementary school that acted out Francis Scott Key stuck in a room asking everyone around him if they could look out the window and see which flag stood, the only light in the pitch black night was from the bombs bursting in the air. He knew if the star spangled banner was no longer standing they had lost, so they each kept a lookout all night long waiting to catch a glimpse of which flag was still there. It was all about a guy looking for a flag.
I grew up in NJ and now I live in Georgia, and I am raising my children here. It was interesting to help my children study an entirely different take on the civil war than what I learned in school. Opinions and even facts are hued by who's glasses you are looking through.
Matt13 posted:CaCO3Girl posted:When you are in America you have the right to not stand or sing the national anthem, but it's just rude not to.
No, it's not. Do you think it's rude of me to refuse to say the Pledge of Allegiance?
In an environment where it is expected... Yes.
CaCO3Girl posted:I had a very energetic music teacher in elementary school that acted out Francis Scott Key stuck in a room asking everyone around him if they could look out the window and see which flag stood, the only light in the pitch black night was from the bombs bursting in the air. He knew if the star spangled banner was no longer standing they had lost, so they each kept a lookout all night long waiting to catch a glimpse of which flag was still there. It was all about a guy looking for a flag.
I grew up in NJ and now I live in Georgia, and I am raising my children here. It was interesting to help my children study an entirely different take on the civil war than what I learned in school. Opinions and even facts are hued by who's glasses you are looking through.
Caco... Here to help. I am going out in a limb and saying I am not the only history teaching coach on here... Check your wars... Might want to edit or delete! Lol.
CoachB25 posted:Per one of the various disagreements in this thread:
I just was listening to a veteran that had lost his legs serving our country. His take was this, he is not upset with Kapernick sitting down as much as he is with what he said afterwards. This guy said, look at the military. It has come so far with regards to officers, race, opportunity and promotions. He said that when he was at war, he had his "brothers" at his side. He didn't care about race. He said that, and I am quoting him here, "when someone speaks of oppression, do they understand the improvements since the Civil Rights movement and how far our society had come." What was tough to take was his statement that he'd give anything to stand one time for the National Anthem.
I think the infographic you posted is less valuable without a comparison. Note that the "All USA" numbers included the black families as well, so the medians without the black families would be even higher.
