Elephant in the room

@baseballhs posted:

There are so many false positives and varied ways of reporting (mixing results from antibody tests with Covid tests, probably cases mixed with actual cases)  if this many people REALLY do have it, we are in great shape since the death rate is down.  MLB players should count their blessings and play ball.  There are a ton of guys out there that aren't getting to, and would in a second.

First, there aren't "so many false positives." The anti-body test, which determines if you HAD it in the past, is flawed and has a lot of false negatives, but there have been no reports of rampant false positives for covid-19 tests. 

Second, yes the death rate is down, but the infection rate is way up.  Increases and decreases in death rates generally trail the same in infection rates by 20-30 days. People don't start showing symptoms and then die the next day - it takes weeks. 

Before anyone argues that we're only seeing an increase in infections because of an increase in testing. Yes, that's true. However, note that the percentage of positives is also increasing with more tests. The only thing that more testing=more positive cases means is that we were most likely UNDER-REPORTING the number of infections early in the pandemic. If we had tested more earlier, we would have found a LOT more cases.

Personally, if I have to go a season without baseball to help insure that NEXT baseball season doesn't have to endure this sh*&sow, I'm OK with that.

@roothog66 posted:

First, there aren't "so many false positives." The anti-body test, which determines if you HAD it in the past, is flawed and has a lot of false negatives, but there have been no reports of rampant false positives for covid-19 tests. 

Second, yes the death rate is down, but the infection rate is way up.  Increases and decreases in death rates generally trail the same in infection rates by 20-30 days. People don't start showing symptoms and then die the next day - it takes weeks. 

Before anyone argues that we're only seeing an increase in infections because of an increase in testing. Yes, that's true. However, note that the percentage of positives is also increasing with more tests. The only thing that more testing=more positive cases means is that we were most likely UNDER-REPORTING the number of infections early in the pandemic. If we had tested more earlier, we would have found a LOT more cases.

Personally, if I have to go a season without baseball to help insure that NEXT baseball season doesn't have to endure this sh*&sow, I'm OK with that.

Why would next season be any different from this season if very few people get infected between now and then? Do you think a vaccine will be available? Or perhaps you think the virus will disappear?

@ABSORBER posted:

Why would next season be any different from this season if very few people get infected between now and then? Do you think a vaccine will be available? Or perhaps you think the virus will disappear?

If you look at countries that took social distancing and wearing masks FAR more so than we do, you'll see a trend. A vaccination by then is definitely a possibility. I'm not as optimistic as the president seems to be on that, but it's definitely in the cards. If you get a vaccine by say, February, it will help going forward and if you have a low number of infections at the time, you will likely not have to take a lot more preventative steps. However, if you have a large number of infections in January or February, any vaccine only starts helping in early summer and you'd need drastic measures again to hold infections down while a vaccine is implemented. So, the better we do at slowing this down NOW, the better off we are if a vaccine comes around in early 2021.

Something I haven't seen addressed is how do people feel about all of the rule experimentation that accompanies a 2020 season?

@roothog66 posted:

If you look at countries that took social distancing and wearing masks FAR more so than we do, you'll see a trend. A vaccination by then is definitely a possibility. I'm not as optimistic as the president seems to be on that, but it's definitely in the cards. If you get a vaccine by say, February, it will help going forward and if you have a low number of infections at the time, you will likely not have to take a lot more preventative steps. However, if you have a large number of infections in January or February, any vaccine only starts helping in early summer and you'd need drastic measures again to hold infections down while a vaccine is implemented. So, the better we do at slowing this down NOW, the better off we are if a vaccine comes around in early 2021.

Something I haven't seen addressed is how do people feel about all of the rule experimentation that accompanies a 2020 season?

The world has never had an RNA based vaccine, and it is not from lack of trying.  The parameters to get one approved in the US have been laid out.  It requires it to be at least 50% more effective than placebo in preventing illness in large randomized, controlled trials. Our annual flu vaccines fluctuate between about 20 and 60% effectiveness and haven't hit 50% since 2013.

We are more likely talking years, not weeks or months to achieve that. 

Pedaldad, without revealing your identity, would you please share your professional credentials?  As CoVid arguments swill in these posts it's hard to keep track of whose opinions are based on experience and education and whose are not.   I don't mean to suggest that I don't value the opinions of  non-medical or science posters here - I do value the opinions of many such posters highly. But professional background is another data point to consider, especially when scientific assertions are made.

@roothog66 posted:

If you look at countries that took social distancing and wearing masks FAR more so than we do, you'll see a trend. A vaccination by then is definitely a possibility. I'm not as optimistic as the president seems to be on that, but it's definitely in the cards. If you get a vaccine by say, February, it will help going forward and if you have a low number of infections at the time, you will likely not have to take a lot more preventative steps. However, if you have a large number of infections in January or February, any vaccine only starts helping in early summer and you'd need drastic measures again to hold infections down while a vaccine is implemented. So, the better we do at slowing this down NOW, the better off we are if a vaccine comes around in early 2021.

Something I haven't seen addressed is how do people feel about all of the rule experimentation that accompanies a 2020 season?

Are you arguing playing baseball will have any impact on this?  Frankly, I doubt it, but I am glad that the players can choose to opt out of they want to. 

Yes, wearing masks and taking social distancing more seriously would have helped, but people (especially young ones) have decided that they don't give a rip.  The only thing we could do to slow the spread would be to force people with the rule of law.

@Chico Escuela posted:

From your earlier post:  "Either masks work or they don’t. If you’re requiring them because they stop the spread then reopen everything. If they don’t work then the mandates are BS."  I don't see room in that sentence for the possibility that masks reduce transmission of the virus, but don't stop it (and therefore don't make it safe to reopen completely.)  But if that's what you meant, then why not wear a mask?

Let's assume it's unclear whether masks reduce C-19 transmission.  If a mask might help prevent you from unknowingly infecting another person, why wouldn't you wear one?  It's 90+ degrees and humid where I live--masks are uncomfortable and fog my glasses.  I also am quite hard of hearing, and masks make it extremely tough to understand speech.  In short, masks are a pain in the rear.  I wear one anyway (and now NC requires it). 

For those who may be interested, here is a demonstration of masks' (imperfect, but helpful) ability to prevent transmission of some types of microorganisms.  It is a demonstration, not a controlled study, and it does not directly consider COVID, but it's illustrative.   

https://twitter.com/richdavisp.../1276629360212979712  

Thanks for that illustration. I saw a few on TV and wow, how gross. 

For those interested, and I have posted before, I live in one of the 3 counties in FL where cases are way up. 15,045 total cases, as of yesterday 425 new cases, 382 deaths. Out of 1.953 million they have only tested 193, 471. They have very few testing sights although the labs, CVS and Walgreens have drive though testing. I also will repeat that we have a whole generation of young folks walking around with Covid, that won't get tested or wear a mask.

Why is this happening in the 3 counties? Some people will say because we are the most liberal, that has nothing to do with it.  Because we have businesses that broke the rules set out by the  counties.and no one was watching as the counties were opening up.  And young people who do not care. They are sick and bringing it home to others. And our Governor never gave a mask order like other states did. He did a photo OP with Pence at a restaurant and no one had masks on.  Finally Senator Rubio broke ranks and said wear the damn mask, too late.

Governor Cuomo went off the rails last week because there was a cluster of reported cases in one area. Apparently a graduate came to Florida and brought back COVID and attended a graduation party. But NY is better at case tracing. 

Just another example of shear stupidity. So Governor Cuomo will not allow anyone from Florida to enter NY, not that we want to go, but we don't want anyone coming to our state unless they live here.  Disney will be opening soon. 

I am fortunate that where I live masks are required and social distancing is required in the few places I have been. I had to go to a lab yesterday as I had to last week as well and I was in and out in 2 minutes. 

For those that don't know I am a young senior. I am so sick and tired of people saying seniors have to stay home so they don't get sick and let the young folks live their lives. Well hell, I am doing my part, you do yours, and that includes wearing a mask and not hanging out shoulder to shoulder face to face in a bar!  

So if we want to come together, we have to respect one another, I don't need to see statistics about not wearing a mask. I don't needs to see stats regarding a mask. We know it helps to slow transition.  If you don't want to wear a mask, STAY HOME.  How 's that?

I am very happy to see more folks on capital hill wearing masks.  It's about time our President stop acting like a child and wear a mask. This will help bring us together.  

I know some won't agree with me, that's ok.  But I feel so much better.

@Viking0 posted:

Are you arguing playing baseball will have any impact on this?  Frankly, I doubt it, but I am glad that the players can choose to opt out of they want to. 

Yes, wearing masks and taking social distancing more seriously would have helped, but people (especially young ones) have decided that they don't give a rip.  The only thing we could do to slow the spread would be to force people with the rule of law.

@Viking0 posted:

Are you arguing playing baseball will have any impact on this?  Frankly, I doubt it, but I am glad that the players can choose to opt out of they want to. 

Yes, wearing masks and taking social distancing more seriously would have helped, but people (especially young ones) have decided that they don't give a rip.  The only thing we could do to slow the spread would be to force people with the rule of law.

Therein lies the rub. Given the attitudes toward social measures, if you're talking ONLY MLB baseball without fans, you're most likely correct that, viewed in isolation, it wouldn't have that much affect. I take into account, however, the message it gives - that everything is going to return to normal, nothing to worry about. I miss sports, but, in the long run, are they really THAT important? 

We are lucky that SARS never really took hold in the US or we would have been screwed. SARS was eradicated without a vaccine because, while they expedited procedures to try and develop one, places where it had spread widely took social precautions seriously to the point where it petered out. Now, THIS virus is a bit more hardy, but the idea we should just say fu%$ it alarms me. 

Do I EXPECT a virus soon? No. The most likely scenario is that it will take years, not months - if we get one at all. However, the American attitude to this is uniquely troubling (with the possible exception of Brazil). If the question is "should we be doing x, y and z in terms of social measures?" the answer is yes. Will we? I doubt it. I think if we continue along this path, next year will only be worse and you might have to count out spectator sports for a couple of years.

@JCG posted:

Pedaldad, without revealing your identity, would you please share your professional credentials?  As CoVid arguments swill in these posts it's hard to keep track of whose opinions are based on experience and education and whose are not.   I don't mean to suggest that I don't value the opinions of  non-medical or science posters here - I do value the opinions of many such posters highly. But professional background is another data point to consider, especially when scientific assertions are made.

Sure, I am a physician/surgeon in one of our country's largest medical institutions.  I  have been there a decade, and practicing since 2002.   In addition to my medical degree, I hold Bachelor of Science degrees in chemistry, biology, and a Master's in Orthopaedic Biomechanics.

Thanks.

On a slightly lighter note... 

Over the course of four days, this past Friday through yesterday, I had to deal with a particular doctor's office, dropping off and picking up a family member Friday and then returning to pick up medication Monday.  It was, by far, the most strict enforcement of Covid precautions I have experienced to date.  The patient was clearly not dealing with Covid - more of a routine check up. 

I had to call when I arrived in the parking lot to arrange drop off.  I was instructed to help the patient into a sort of quarantined holding room, then leave and seal the door closed behind me, and then one of the fully protected medical staff members would clear the patient and take them into an isolated room for assessment.  The doctor called me while I waited in the parking lot to review the findings and discuss course of action.  Then, the same procedure was followed with the exit, only out of a totally separate "exit/discharge" holding room on the other side of the building.  

When picking up the medication yesterday, I went through much of the same where I had to call in that I was in the parking lot.  The meds were then left in a sealed box on the exterior of the building for me to access.  I had to call back to assure I received the package and was clear of the area.

The patient was my dog.  I was at the vet's office. 

Cabbage, my vet has been doing likewise since early April.

(The human docs I have dealt with are behaving similarly. It’s almost as though they think something serious is going on...)

Same way here. My grand dog coming here for a week so daughter had him groomed. The drill is that you are not allowed to enter and must pay over the phone. And you have to wait in the car until they bring him out.

Same way with the vetenarian.  Overall everyone is very careful here and businesses have done a great job of being compliant. So has my community. 

“fu%$”

!!!!!!

Roothog, you had me at “f”, not to mention “x, y, and z”!

@Chico Escuela posted:

Cabbage, my vet has been doing likewise since early April.

(The human docs I have dealt with are behaving similarly. It’s almost as though they think something serious is going on...)

For sure... just struck me as kinda funny that it was far more stringent than the practices going on in places I've been where humans are the main focus... stores, restaurants, chiropractor, work office, etc.  Most are taking reasonable measures, just not nearly to that extent.

How anyone views the situation will be impacted by their location. A cousin is a doctor of immunology in the NYC area. His wife, also a doctor caught COVID badly enough to spend a night in the hospital under observation with an extremely high temperature. His name was on a petition for a complete lock down of the country. 

I left the Boston area for my second home in Maine. I had just been made aware 95 of the first 100 COVID cases were traced back to a conference I had lunch across the street. I figured Maine doesn’t have international travel during mud season. I thought Maine might only need to slow down and distance rather than shut down. I was wrong. The governor treated the state and talked like Maine is NYC. What did surprise me was the effect the fear mongering by the governor and the local media had on people from reading the comments under news articles.

I’m 65, fit and in excellent health. I weigh less than I did as a college athlete. I’m not as bulked up. Given not one healthy person in Maine has died (of 105 out of a 1,344,000 pop) I’m not real concerned. Only one employee at all the grocery stores in the state caught COVID. Masks weren’t mandated until the state started opening up. I noticed the last time I went to the grocery store there wasn’t a employee tracking how many shoppers were in the store. 

I haven’t worn a mask anywhere except when an older person politely asked me to put one on. I ignore the COVID Nazis. I’ve been out to lunch or dinner with friends seven times over the past month. None of us have worn masks except when required to pass the hostess/reservation station. All the dining has been outdoors even though inside dining has returned.

I have been in three COVID trace lines. In all three of my contacts was a parent of an early 20’s adult kid who visited their parents for dinner. The kids likely caught COVID due to being in bars and clubs. The parents tested negative.

The big change now is the death rate is diminishing across the country. It’s younger people who are getting COVID from getting back in social environments. While it’s not a positive to get COVID we now know keep at risk people away from those who are taking risks.

Another issue I haven’t seen in the news is if people isolate for three months their immune system as a whole diminishes making them more vulnerable to any virus or disease. We’re more vulnerable now than three months ago. We live in a dirty, diseased world. Normal, every day life maintains our immune system. I’ve always been a little phobic about how and where I touch doors to open. Who knows if the last person who touched the door handle was picking his ass an half hour ago.

I’ve been in no rush to get back to Boston. I live fifteen miles outside the city. I’m going for the first time since mid March in a couple of days. Without access to Boston entertainment I prefer to be in Maine for day to day life.  

(Haven’t stayed in a Holiday Inn Express in the past year)

Declining death rates is very good news. Increasing hospitalization numbers, not so much (and hospitalizations will lag the recent increases in positive tests).  

I am a compulsive reader of news. And outside of social media and some political rallies, I don’t see the same ideas many folks express here that the nation’s reaction is overblown. So far as I can see, the great majority of governors, public health officials and other decision makers sound more concerned than a lot of people commenting here.  States, not the federal government, are the primary actors, and governors in the south and southwest seem fairly alarmed by recent trends.  All due respect—and you may be proven right—but that seems to be the situation on the ground. 

Even if you don't like Fauci, did you at least notice that he was wearing a Washington Nationals mask today?

If you want to know what's really happening in TX

https://twitter.com/AlexBerens...773122301804546?s=19

Ignore Berenson if you want, but he did get the person to go on the record with his name and credentials. It's stuff like this that isn't getting reported. What a shame

@anotherparent posted:

Even if you don't like Fauci, did you at least notice that he was wearing a Washington Nationals mask today?

I did.  I also noticed that he and Redfield both reached their hands to their respective faces to take it off everytime they answered a question.  Then they rested their hands on the table in front of them.  This happened repeatedly and is not the ideal use of a mask, but typical with what most lay people do.  In surgery, if we screw up touch our mask, we have to de-glove, de-gown, go scrub and start all over again.  Technically speaking, they contaminated everything around them.  Them wearing masks in this manner is pure dog and pony show.  FWIW.

@Pedaldad posted:

I did.  I also noticed that he and Redfield both reached their hands to their respective faces to take it off everytime they answered a question.  Then they rested their hands on the table in front of them.  This happened repeatedly and is not the ideal use of a mask, but typical with what most lay people do.  In surgery, if we screw up touch our mask, we have to de-glove, de-gown, go scrub and start all over again.  Technically speaking, they contaminated everything around them.  Them wearing masks in this manner is pure dog and pony show.  FWIW.

Right, but the mask isn't being used in the same way in that environment as it would in a surgery.  The purpose is different.  I'm sure Fauci didn't scrub down before he went to the podium either.  He just washed his hands for twenty second or used some hand sanitizer.

Man, lighten up just a little...  At least he wasn't wearing a soccer team mask.  That's all I was saying.

If you contaminate everything around you...what difference did the mask make???

@baseballhs posted:

If you contaminate everything around you...what difference did the mask make???

Seriously?  He did not contaminate "everything around him" merely by touching his mask a couple of times and then touching the table.  He maybe, if he was infected, got a tiny bit of virus on the part of the table he touched, where it promptly died or was too small a viral load to do anything to anyone.

But, if he had sneezed, at least some of the giant droplets containing much more virus would not have sprayed out several feet into the room, where it had a much better chance of actually infecting someone also in the room.  That is how the mask can make a difference and that is why we should wear them while indoors with other people who cannot easily socially distance or must stay in the room with us for extended periods of time.

The point is to reasonably reduce risk not eliminate it.

@baseballhs posted:

If you contaminate everything around you...what difference did the mask make???

If you have not seen it, this WSJ piece may be helpful and of interest.  The understanding of how this virus is transmitted has really changed over the past few months.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/h...onsensus-11592317650

@James G posted:

If you want to know what's really happening in TX

https://twitter.com/AlexBerens...773122301804546?s=19

Ignore Berenson if you want, but he did get the person to go on the record with his name and credentials. It's stuff like this that isn't getting reported. What a shame

Wow, reading the comments on this tweet shows a lot of people all over, seeing the same thing. Hospitals with lots of patients that aren't Covid and a lot of Covid patients with very mild or no symptoms.  Health professionals angry about the way this is being misrepresented.  I'm in Texas too, and I'm in agreement, it's not the wild Wild West the media is making it out to be.

@baseballhs posted:

Wow, reading the comments on this tweet shows a lot of people all over, seeing the same thing. Hospitals with lots of patients that aren't Covid and a lot of Covid patients with very mild or no symptoms.  Health professionals angry about the way this is being misrepresented.  I'm in Texas too, and I'm in agreement, it's not the wild Wild West the media is making it out to be.

Serious question:  Do you think Governor Abbott isn't basing his decisions to roll back re-opening on accurate information?  Because I would expect he is--and he has access to Twitter, too.  If there is some conspiracy to make things look worse than they are, then it is taking in most southern state governments at this point.

I think he is under pressure because cases have gone up. I have seen multiple hospital administrators say that the media is misrepresenting the hospitalization information.  One Houston hospital was in multiple headline over being at 95% capacity. The administrator came out and said that they were also at 95% last year without Covid and this is not uncommon or something they panic over.  I‘ll put it this way, I’m not remotely panicking.  I’ve flown 4 times this month and I’m getting ready to do it again. I eat out often. I wish I was watching more baseball, it I’ll take ehat I can get.

It would be really great if all these young people are going out and breathing on each other, then taking precautions around everyone else.  I agree that right now the rates are driven by them, and their risk of serious consequences is low.  If it stays in that population and then goes away, that would be fantastic.

I'm sure that the worry is that the more widespread it is in the community, the more likely it is to spread to people who do get serious illness.  Sure the hospitals are usually at 95% capacity, but there isn't usually a pandemic going on.  If - and maybe it's a big if - the disease spreads to people who start getting really sick, then that 95% capacity is going to be a big problem.  I'm assuming that that is what someone has pointed out to the governors.

As with everything with this virus, we will know in a few weeks.

@Pedaldad posted:

I did.  I also noticed that he and Redfield both reached their hands to their respective faces to take it off everytime they answered a question.  Then they rested their hands on the table in front of them.  This happened repeatedly and is not the ideal use of a mask, but typical with what most lay people do.  In surgery, if we screw up touch our mask, we have to de-glove, de-gown, go scrub and start all over again.  Technically speaking, they contaminated everything around them.  Them wearing masks in this manner is pure dog and pony show.  FWIW.

Yep. And likely put himself at greater risk by touching the mask and his face over and over. 

@LuckyCat posted:

Right, but the mask isn't being used in the same way in that environment as it would in a surgery.  The purpose is different.  I'm sure Fauci didn't scrub down before he went to the podium either.  He just washed his hands for twenty second or used some hand sanitizer.

Lucky Cat I understand the difference between viral and bacterial spread very well.  The purpose in surgery is to not contaminate the surgical field.  The assumed purpose in wearing a mask to prevent C-19 droplets from contaminating the surrounding area, quite similar actually. 

There is inherent flaw in the way that Fauci and Redfield were wearing the masks to breath and then taking them off to speak.   This is when large respiratory droplets are most likely to be scattered, when we speak, cough, etc.   Breathing in the mask, little droplets are being scattered everywhere, and there is no controlling that with or without a mask. The additional problem is when you breath into the mask there is scatter of small particles to your face.  When you remove the mask, touching the contaminated mask, your face and then the table in front of you with the same hand....well the technical medical description of that is contaminating f******* everything.  When I train my residents I generally try to teach them the proper way to do things.  This was a lesson of how to not use a mask.

@anotherparent posted:

Man, lighten up just a little...  At least he wasn't wearing a soccer team mask.  That's all I was saying.

Did appreciate your observation, but their (Fauci and Redfield) use of masks was so appalling, as it does more harm than good.  If you're going to recommend people use masks to protect the at risk and want to demonstrate the importance, at least do so responsibly.   Leave them on when you speak.  Don't touch or fiddle with them unless necessary, and sanitize your hands everytime you do.   What they did was completely wrong unless the goal was to protect themselves, not those around them.

@JCG posted:

If you have not seen it, this WSJ piece may be helpful and of interest.  The understanding of how this virus is transmitted has really changed over the past few months.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/h...onsensus-11592317650

Thanks for posting, JCG... a solid piece from a media outlet that is rated as one of the most reliable, factual and politically unbiased/neutral.  Unfortunately, that means many will dismiss it because, well, you know.

WSJ is a very good paper, but is considered right of Center, opinion wise. It is not politically neutral. A news source like Reuters would be considered neutral by most.

Less than 5% of any publications are right of center if not less

@edcoach posted:

Less than 5% of any publications are right of center if not less

According to whom?

@Pedaldad posted:

Lucky Cat I understand the difference between viral and bacterial spread very well.  The purpose in surgery is to not contaminate the surgical field.  The assumed purpose in wearing a mask to prevent C-19 droplets from contaminating the surrounding area, quite similar actually. 

There is inherent flaw in the way that Fauci and Redfield were wearing the masks to breath and then taking them off to speak.   This is when large respiratory droplets are most likely to be scattered, when we speak, cough, etc.   Breathing in the mask, little droplets are being scattered everywhere, and there is no controlling that with or without a mask. The additional problem is when you breath into the mask there is scatter of small particles to your face.  When you remove the mask, touching the contaminated mask, your face and then the table in front of you with the same hand....well the technical medical description of that is contaminating f******* everything.  When I train my residents I generally try to teach them the proper way to do things.  This was a lesson of how to not use a mask.

 

I wasn't suggesting you didn't understand.  I was pointing out that he isn't trying to use the mask the way you as a medical doctor would in a surgery or even in a hospital.  He isn't trying to keep a sterile field around him.  He is using it the way the rest of us (hopefully) are using masks in our daily lives right now to lessen the risk of community spread.  In taking the mask off to speak, he is balancing the risk that he will get some small amount of virus on the table or his hand or in the air around him while he communicates important information to the public about what is going on with the pandemic.  If everyone else is also wearing a mask, staying six feet apart, keeping talking to a minimum, and staying in the room only as long as necessary, the risk is minimal and worth it so the public health experts can keep the public informed. 

If we wanted to try to eliminate the risk, we would all hermetically seal ourselves in bubbles, and Fauci would never talk to the public.  

Pfizer and BioNTech announce early positive data from phase 1/2 Covid VACCINE study.   I am hopeful that all the resources being thrown at Covid will result in an RNA vaccine in record time.....  Waiting on the details but market seems to like it.

* GloFisher please give us the read!

@cabbagedad posted:

Thanks for posting, JCG... a solid piece from a media outlet that is rated as one of the most reliable, factual and politically unbiased/neutral.  Unfortunately, that means many will dismiss it because, well, you know.

It’s not unbiased news unless I agree. 😁 The reality is there are two sets of news from two completely different planets. One is nothing but lies. The other is completely the truth. A person just has to decide which version of reality they prefer. 

I’ve watched a story on one side of cable news then turned to the other side and watched an interpretation that made me wonder if they’re from the same planet. 

The only way to get closer to the truth is read a news aggregator with coverage from both sides. Then sort out what makes sense as reality. I assembled my own news and opinion package from Flipboard. I also find Media Bias/Fact Check and Allsides to be reasonably accurate in their evaluation of news sources. Even then your view will be distorted by your biases. 

It’s sad I find the need to know the source and the writer before reading a news story or opinion. What I find disappointing is it’s hard to get news without an opinionated twist. Just the facts is long gone.

@edcoach posted:

Less than 5% of any publications are right of center if not less

There are so many news sources I doubt 5% is true. But a noticeable number of mainstream sources are left than right.

To prove it to a friend I took the lead newspapaer in every major city. I went through their presidential endorsement for the past fifty years. The endorsements were about 75% Democrat. The year Reagan swamped Mondale 49-1 in states two thirds endorsed Mondale.

I consider myself I reasonably rational right leaning libertarian. I’ll see right wing articles that make me cringe. But I believe the reason the left believes the media is relatively unbiased is being told what they prefer to hear.

The Boston Globe has twelve liberal columnists and one on the moderate right. The paper is so excessively left it’s repulsive. I can get the same news and views from Slate, Salon and Vox. The Globe and it’s readers look down their noses at the Herald. The Herald has six columns from the left and six from the right. All the left points at for an example of the Herald is Howie Carr who can be a lunatic.

Left leaning New York Times readers believe a David Brooks is a conservative.