Interesting tidbits from recent recruiting survey

It's all cookie cutter. Ask a coach whether he would have 5 90+ pitchers or 5 sub 85 guys with character. The coaches down in Georgia are scouting talent not character. Yes it helps, but it is not the most important quality. Unless you're an absolute jerk or can't read, your talent will get you a baseball scholarship.

8/10 for parental involvement. Not even sure what that means. 

PABaseball posted:

It's all cookie cutter. Ask a coach whether he would have 5 90+ pitchers or 5 sub 85 guys with character. The coaches down in Georgia are scouting talent not character. Yes it helps, but it is not the most important quality. Unless you're an absolute jerk or can't read, your talent will get you a baseball scholarship.

8/10 for parental involvement. Not even sure what that means. 

I think they meant the impact the parents have on the ultimate decision to attend  particular school.  And I would have to believe the character question is in addition to athletic prowess.  I agree.  A 90+ guy will always trump the 83-85 guy with a great disposition. lol

But the 89 guy with good character will trump the 90 guy with bad character.  i think many coaches are tired of babysitting stupidity in college.  I know of three local guys who were dismissed from teams this year for bad choices.  too many good players out there to have to deal with some of this stuff.  When they use the word recruit it tells me they are good enough to be considered so then the intangibles. 

I wonder what they truly mean by negative parental involvement.  I know the stories but is that all?  I know some coaches have told me one of the most frustrating aspects of recruiting is having to not only sell the player but the parents.  Some see it as negative when parents start asking the tough questions but I think that is our job.

PitchingFan posted:

I know some coaches have told me one of the most frustrating aspects of recruiting is having to not only sell the player but the parents.  Some see it as negative when parents start asking the tough questions but I think that is our job.

To me, this is a no-brainer. A) Many times the parents are footing the bill, B) physiologically, the kids' brains are not done cooking yet, and C) many parents have been-there-done-that-got-the-tee-shirt. My thought is that if the coaches aren't welcoming of the parents then maybe that isn't the place for the kid. Obviously every situation is different but it would seem to me that a coach is somewhat naïve if they think the parents don't need to be sold as well, especially with the cost of an education these days.

This "tidbit" is nothing but a marketing strategy from a recruiting services viewpoint (& obviously the OP)...Not objective, so not much real value...Who conducted this "survey" or research? Was it done by a neutral party?   Who, specifically were the respondents? Was it designed for only certain levels of Coaches/recruits? Or is this a "cherry-picked" version? Where's the entire survey?

This info is so generic, it's fodder. Best advise is do your homework. Due diligence...example, back in the day, son was recruited by a couple SEC Schools...Low & behold, a quick check with NCAA showed that one institutions was on  probation...known cheating to keep kids eligible...Another infraction & they could be suspended...

Just ask the recruiting coach or head coach a few important questions...What kind of Academic support? Is there a "proxy test giver" when guys are on the road? 

Be sure your athlete knows what a syllabus is! Be sure he establishes an open line of communication with profs, etc...

Concerning character, these Coaches have "spies in the land", I assure you! Coaches talk! It's a small world.

In my opinion NCSA is a waste of time & money.    NCSA is just another scam in the travel ball world.

^^^^ 

3and2Fastball posted:

In my opinion NCSA is a waste of time & money.    NCSA is just another scam in the travel ball world.

If we're going to go there, I'll give my two cents as someone with direct experience. After being referred to NCSA by a friend, we had an initial "evaluation" call and it was a HARD sell that took up at least the last 15 minutes of a 45 minute call. The dude knew that my son was on the phone as well and said some things that made the sense of urgency seem greater than it was. Despite this, we signed on anyway because we didn't know anything. I found HSBBW (and a couple of other no-cost treasure troves of information) two months later and would not have spent the $2034.00 that was required had I known about them earlier. The service was very useful in one way; the consolidated database of colleges and ability to search based on any number of filters, including things specific to baseball. Still not worth two grand but hindsight is 20/20 and I don't beat myself up about it. It ended up having little to no impact on my son's recruiting journey.

If NCSA is selling, I'm not buying.   Recruits and parents have to find their own way and do the hard work.   There are so many paths that require the recruit think for themselves.   Nobody can do it for you, and nobody is going to work as hard.  Save your hard earned money.

As always, JMO.

So you did it again Rocky.  You started a thread that bashes NCSA and recruiting sites.   I'm not sure if your plan is advertising for them or you are just sold on them but here goes.  I tell anyone who asks unless you have $2-3000 to throw away you do not need a recruiting site.  You can do all the work yourself or you can give me $3,000 and I will tell you what you want to hear.  For $3,000, I can be very appeasing. 

Fenway & PitchingFan...another 

And, Fenway, you know best! You're our resident expert on D-3's! So you're  "JMO" garners the greatest of respect in this community! 

tequila said "Still not worth two grand but hindsight is 20/20 and I don't beat myself up about it. It ended up having little to no impact on my son's recruiting journey.

That's been the consensus on hsbbweb since the inception! Glad you "found the light!"Still not worth two grand but hindsight /20 and I don't beat myself up about it. It ended up beat myself u little to no impact on my son's recruiting journey

baseballmom posted:

That's been the consensus on hsbbweb since the inception! Glad you "found the light!"

Unfortunately found the light $2K lighter in my wallet!

In my era recruiting was all word of mouth and coach’s help. There weren’t showcases and travel tournaments. I was fortunate to play on teams with other scouted players. Thirty years later my oldest (daughter) became a softball prospect. I had no idea what to do. 

Her travel program bumped her up to the Gold team. The coach told us to make a list. He said it was all going to happen fast. Girls are physically mature entering high school. I was advised do not use a recruiting service. A teammate’s parent with two girls already in college softball offered to help by sharing his experience. He advised do not use a recruiting service.

When I joined this board my son was fourteen. From experience I understood the process. But I still needed to know timing and destinations for baseball recruiting.

A friend’s son didn’t have a clue on the process. My first advice? Don’t pay anyone. I’ll help and you join hsbaseballweb for multiple alternate opinions. They hired an individual consultant for $1200. He gave them horrible advice. The mother finally asked how I know as much as this guy and respond faster for free. 

I told her I’ve been through it. But I’ve been on hsbaseballweb (at that time) for three years. What I don’t know or want more information I post a question and tell you the intelligent responses that relate to your son.

So my 2022s travel org (community based - t-ball rec through college wood bat) signed the whole team up, along with the 2020s and 2021s. NCSA did a webinar for the kids and then they try to upgrade (to what I am not sure) you via individual calls . It's been helpful to understand the process (transcripts, measurables, video, awards etc . Kid has a few DIII and 1 DI search and follows and some camp invites after a month of being in the system, but I had no idea it cost 2k!

Best recruiting advice I can/do give to anyone who will listen is to get on HSBBW!  Everything you ever needed or wanted to know can be found here and the 2 best parts are the people here who are more than willing to help and the cost!  My son even tries to help out younger classmates by pushing them to get active in their own recruiting as well as checking out the site.  Unfortunately fear and pressure from many of the recruiting services get many to buy into the hype of needing to use them.  

PitchingFan posted:

So you did it again Rocky.  You started a thread that bashes NCSA and recruiting sites.   I'm not sure if your plan is advertising for them or you are just sold on them but here goes.  I tell anyone who asks unless you have $2-3000 to throw away you do not need a recruiting site.  You can do all the work yourself or you can give me $3,000 and I will tell you what you want to hear.  For $3,000, I can be very appeasing. 

I referenced a survey that was just released.  I said specifically I was not plugging NCSA.  However, it's difficult to mention a survey and not mention where it came from.  I did not include a link to the survey. 

Some swear by Perfect Game and some say stay as far away as possible, because all it is is a money maker.  Some think specific prospect camps like Headfirst are worth their weight in gold.  Other's believe it's ridiculous and silly to spend that kind of money on any camp.  These things are all resources.  You use the resources you want, don't use the ones you don't believe in.  It's entirely up to you. People on here have a right to hear from all of us.  I like NCSA.  Respect that.  You obviously don't like NCSA.  I respect that.  Parents should hear about specific horror stories about different companies like NCSA, Perfect Game Prospectwire, BeRecruited, etc. But you should not try to censor anyone who likes these services who may have positive things to say. Yo are an anonymous person on this board.  we don't know who you are.  You can't be vetted.  How do we know if the information you share is valid? How do we know you are not being paid to bash NCSA?  See how silly this becomes.  If you have specific stories that you can share that are constructive that can help people, share them.  You don't have to be nasty about it.

And by the way, the reality is my post had nothing to do with promoting anyone.  a few of you have made it that for some strange reason.  

 "Some think specific prospect camps like Headfirst are worth their weight in gold.  Other's believe it's ridiculous and silly to spend that kind of money on any camp.  "

I  have been on this site for 6 years now (I think) and have read at least a dozen threads on Headfirst and can't recall a single person saying anything remotely like that about it. Is that your opinion? Or can you point me to an online resource that presents that opinion. Are you bundling college prospect camps with HF and the like?  If so,  I would advise you not to. They are apples and oranges.

 "You don't have to be nasty about it."

Ironically that's what I thought about you when you attacked me for no reason in your first thread on this site.

No one is censoring your post. But you have to understand everything NCSA (or similar organizations ) posts has marketing in it. 45% leave their first team is FUD (fear, uncertainty, doubt, you better acquire our help so you don’t shortchange your kid). Do you think it’s coincidence it’s the first data point? But where did the data come from? Who was polled or what group was analyzed?

You have every right to post you believe in the value of recruiting services. But everyone who disagrees has the right to post their opinion. There probably won’t be enough posts to make an accurate data analysis. But from my twelve years on the board I would say the view is eight or nine to one against recruiting services. 

Make your point. If people disagree make a counterpoint. But don’t take it personally. There isn’t a person on this board who hasn’t faced disagreement.

tequila posted:

3and2Fastball posted:

In my opinion NCSA is a waste of time & money.    NCSA is just another scam in the travel ball world.

If we're going to go there, I'll give my two cents as someone with direct experience. After being referred to NCSA by a friend, we had an initial "evaluation" call and it was a HARD sell that took up at least the last 15 minutes of a 45 minute call. The dude knew that my son was on the phone as well and said some things that made the sense of urgency seem greater than it was. Despite this, we signed on anyway because we didn't know anything. I found HSBBW (and a couple of other no-cost treasure troves of information) two months later and would not have spent the $2034.00 that was required had I known about them earlier. The service was very useful in one way; the consolidated database of colleges and ability to search based on any number of filters, including things specific to baseball. Still not worth two grand but hindsight is 20/20 and I don't beat myself up about it. It ended up having little to no impact on my son's recruiting journey.

I agree, this part was the most beneficial to me: "The consolidated database of colleges and ability to search based on any number of filters, including things specific to baseball."  Everything else, not so much.  For me, 95% of its value is the database.  But you can find all the information in the database, without it.  The service locks you up for 2 years at like $100 a month.  It's steep.  You are basically paying $2,400 for access to a database.

Rocky, so far everything you've posted (at least as far as I can tell) has included a little plug for NCSA.   If your intent isn't to plug NCSA, it would be awesome if you shared some other aspects of how you view the Baseball industry.

If your intent is to make it seem like you want to be part of the HSBBW community while plugging NCSA, you need to know that you are really really not slick.

We see through right through that kind of thing.  Just some real talk as to why you are getting the responses you are.   If anything, you are making it much much less likely that anyone here would give NCSA a dime, let alone a dollar.

My view is a database isn’t worth $2,400. My son and I sat down and came up with a list of fifty colleges of interest where he might be capable of playing. We took twenty-five names each, looked up their websites gathering names of head coaches and assistant in charge of recruiting along with email and phone number. Then we called each athletic department to verify the information. Even if we had been given the data we would have called to verify. 

The project didn’t take very long. It was done in small chunks over a couple of weeks. My son was invested in the effort. We were working as a team. I didn’t care about his tight schedule. I wanted him to know up front college baseball and academics was going to be a life of tight schedules and time management.

RJM posted:

No one is censoring your post. But you have to understand everything NCSA (or similar organizations ) posts has marketing in it. 45% leave their first team is FUD (fear, uncertainty, doubt, you better acquire our help so you don’t shortchange your kid). Do you think it’s coincidence it’s the first data point? But where did the data come from? Who was polled or what group was analyzed?

You have every right to post you believe in the value of recruiting services. But everyone who disagrees has the right to post their opinion. There probably won’t be enough posts to make an accurate data analysis. But from my twelve years on the board I would say the view is eight or nine to one against recruiting services. 

Make your point. If people disagree make a counterpoint. But don’t take it personally. There isn’t a person on this board who hasn’t faced disagreement.

I put it as the first data point, cause I thought it was interesting that the number was that high.  I was curious as to what others thought about it?  But, since you are asking, the survey was administered to approx. 12,000 student-athletes, 7,500 parents, 1,000 club coaches, 1,100 high school coaches and 500 college coaches, as well as analysis of college roster data from 1,400 schools, including 365 Division 1, 284 Division 2, 472 Division 3 and 279 NAIA teams.

I love debating.  I expect people to disagree and discuss why. I just don't get a lot of whys.  I don't appreciate being accused of working for the company when I give my opinion.  It's juvenile. Can't have it both ways.  Can't have folks disparage me and then say not to take it personally right?  Just because one says favorable things about Perfect Game doesn't mean they work for Perfect Game. 

I better acquire "your" help?  Who are you? I know who I spoke with at NCSA.  I have his name, where he went to school, where he played, where he coached.  I can google him, my son can talk to him on the phone.  Skype with him.  My has spoken to coaches he introduced my son to. 

I don't mean any disrespect, but who are you?  As far as I know you never played the sport, never had a kid who did either.  Yet, I am suppose to take advise from you over someone I know exists?  Think about that.  So where do you get all your information Rocky? RJM!  What's his name and what are his qualifications?  oh, I don't know. 

RJM posted:

My view is a database isn’t worth $2,400. My son and I sat down and came up with a list of fifty colleges of interest where he might be capable of playing. We each took twenty-five names each, looked up their websites gathering names of head coaches and assistant in charge of recruiting along with email and phone number. Then we called each athletic department to verify the information. Even if we had been given the data we would have called to verify. 

The project didn’t take very long. It was done in small chunks over a couple of weeks. My son was invested in the effort. We were working as a team. I didn’t care about his tight schedule. I wanted him to know up front college baseball and academics was going to be a life of tight schedules and time management.

 

Totally agree here but I do think that the database and search tools are worth something, especially to folks who are not as equipped going into it as others. I quite literally knew nothing about the process, was not a college athlete, and neither of my older kids even played sports in high school. I found many of these tools around the same time but I do wish I had found hsbbw and keepplayingbaseball before NCSA.

I better acquire "your" help? 

There’s that reading comprehension thing again. I have no idea where this came from. 

Did the NCSA people ever see your son play in person on multiple occasions? Without seeing your son play on multiple occasions how can they assess his potential and where he should focus recruiting efforts?

Rocky, that failure number is well know on this board. It’s why you didn’t get any “wow” responses. The reason the number is so well known is the wealth of knowledge and experience on this board. 

I was trying to help you get along on this board. I don’t want to make it about individuals. But you couldn’t help but go there. Because of the respect I have for so many people on this board I’m not going to one up anyone by posting my resume. There are many people here without my baseball background who have my baseball knowledge. A couple of them are mothers. It’s because they listened to people along the journey rather than trying to tell more knowledgeable people what they should know. Even with my baseball knowledge I know when to shut up and listen. There’s always something to be learned.

The most dangerous person on this board is the person who doesn’t even have a clue what it is they don’t know. It’s called unconscious incompetence. Hopefully, you’re not beyond help.

Moderators, please let Rocky stay despite his inclination to fight everyone. He’s freak’n amusing. 

Rocky, if you want to know who people are,  try reading old threads, or try using the private message function and ask. You have been corresponding with parents of current and former players from a wide variety of D1, D2 and D3 conferences.

JCG posted:

Rocky, if you want to know who people are,  try reading old threads, or try using the private message function and ask. You have been corresponding with parents of current and former players from a wide variety of D1, D2 and D3 conferences.

Also son’s in the minors, majors, son’s who have gone on to college and pro coaching, There are also high school coaches, travel coaches and pro scouts on this site.

Rocky Alvarez posted:

RJM posted:

 

I better acquire "your" help?  Who are you? I know who I spoke with at NCSA.  I have his name, where he went to school, where he played, where he coached.  I can google him, my son can talk to him on the phone.  Skype with him.  My has spoken to coaches he introduced my son to. 

I don't mean any disrespect, but who are you?  As far as I know you never played the sport, never had a kid who did either.  Yet, I am suppose to take advise from you over someone I know exists?  Think about that.  So where do you get all your information Rocky? RJM!  What's his name and what are his qualifications?  oh, I don't know. 

 

Send a pm to RJM. Get to know him. Or ANY of the frequent posters on this site. In my experience, I have found that most people on this site, especially the ones that care enough to take the time to share their honest opinions and experience, are open and approachable. They are real people that have no issues with sharing their identity. 

RoadRunner posted:

Rocky Alvarez posted:

RJM posted:

 

I better acquire "your" help?  Who are you? I know who I spoke with at NCSA.  I have his name, where he went to school, where he played, where he coached.  I can google him, my son can talk to him on the phone.  Skype with him.  My has spoken to coaches he introduced my son to. 

I don't mean any disrespect, but who are you?  As far as I know you never played the sport, never had a kid who did either.  Yet, I am suppose to take advise from you over someone I know exists?  Think about that.  So where do you get all your information Rocky? RJM!  What's his name and what are his qualifications?  oh, I don't know. 

 

Send a pm to RJM. Get to know him. Or ANY of the frequent posters on this site. In my experience, I have found that most people on this site, especially the ones that care enough to take the time to share their honest opinions and experience, are open and approachable. They are real people that have no issues with sharing their identity. 

I’ve had a lot of private conversations with posters looking for help. But I don’t PM with lunatics. 

Rocky Alvarez posted:

PitchingFan posted:

So you did it again Rocky.  You started a thread that bashes NCSA and recruiting sites.   I'm not sure if your plan is advertising for them or you are just sold on them but here goes.  I tell anyone who asks unless you have $2-3000 to throw away you do not need a recruiting site.  You can do all the work yourself or you can give me $3,000 and I will tell you what you want to hear.  For $3,000, I can be very appeasing. 

I referenced a survey that was just released.  I said specifically I was not plugging NCSA.  However, it's difficult to mention a survey and not mention where it came from.  I did not include a link to the survey. 

Some swear by Perfect Game and some say stay as far away as possible, because all it is is a money maker.  Some think specific prospect camps like Headfirst are worth their weight in gold.  Other's believe it's ridiculous and silly to spend that kind of money on any camp.  These things are all resources.  You use the resources you want, don't use the ones you don't believe in.  It's entirely up to you. People on here have a right to hear from all of us.  I like NCSA.  Respect that.  You obviously don't like NCSA.  I respect that.  Parents should hear about specific horror stories about different companies like NCSA, Perfect Game Prospectwire, BeRecruited, etc. But you should not try to censor anyone who likes these services who may have positive things to say. Yo are an anonymous person on this board.  we don't know who you are.  You can't be vetted.  How do we know if the information you share is valid? How do we know you are not being paid to bash NCSA?  See how silly this becomes.  If you have specific stories that you can share that are constructive that can help people, share them.  You don't have to be nasty about it.

 

And by the way, the reality is my post had nothing to do with promoting anyone.  a few of you have made it that for some strange reason.  

I simply stated the obvious.  Since you ahve been on here as Rocky or R you have referenced NCSA in every post and two you started are about NCSA or one of their resources so I'm assuming you are deeply invested in it to some format.  You say you don't know me and I am anonymous well that is a lie as most of the regular posters on here are not.  Most of us have shared our identities either directly or indirectly by telling who our kids are.  You have to understand that this is a lot like a family on here.  We will fight each other every day and I mean every day because we don't always agree.  But we won't let someone else come on here and pick a fight with another brother/sister.  And God forbid daddy or mama have to get involved cause will shut this thing down (like they already did to your other thread).   That is why it is personal when we talk to,  about, argue with, and support each other.  We are a family.  We sincerely are proud of CabbageDad's son because we know the story and the ups and downs.  Some of us have been here for over a decade and know these other people personally either in person (several on here I have met over the years at tournaments, we used to do a day at WWBA where we met with each other) or because I have read all their stuff.  They know me and my kids, btw 2 D1 pitchers and one is a college softball coach now and a high school coach.  Have been high school baseball and softball coach and umpired both in high school and college.  Umpired baseball into minor leagues.   We would love to welcome you to the journey.  Just quit pushing a product so hard.  I'm a fan of PG but I will also be truthful about their misgivings.  One of the greatest resources that has ever been on here was PGSTAFF and we ran him off.  I met him face to face due to being on here and he is as genuine as it gets.  I've not always agreed with them and stated that numerous times on here but I think they are the best in the business.  I also support PBR highly.  Both were very instrumental in my son getting where he is now at University of Tennessee.  But I don't try to jam either down everybody's throats.  Welcome to famliy.  Hope you stay long enough for us to fight for you as well as with you. 

A couple words in defense of Rocky:

1. He is speaking from his experience, just like the rest of us. His experience includes a positive relationship with NCSA. That's what he's talking about. It's no different from the posters who speak positively about the particular showcases or tournaments or private coaches who were beneficial to them. That he has a perspective not shared by most of us is a good reason for it to be expressed here, so it can be discussed on its merits.

2. The Rocky vs. R screen name was not an attempt at deception. His Rocky screen name was temporarily disabled and he used the R. name to inquire about it in a PM.

Let's give the new member a chance.

Fair enough swampboy. I guess that is the umpire coming out....I don't want to get tossed!  ;-)

Rocky - I've been on this site a while.   I've seen many people use recruiting services either because they thought they  didn't have the time or expertise.   In almost every case, their shortcut did not work out or they did not get the intended value for their money.   All the information and people resources were right here on HSBBWeb willing to help them.  I've helped numerous folks (even a couple by telephone with some unique circumstances) on here and I know they in turn have helped many others.   Most of the answers are right here with our members.  

I did not use a recruiting service, but I did see many others disappointed with their decisision to pursue that option.  Whether or not the right expectations were set, I don't know.  I'm glad you had a positive experience, and possibly these services are getting better than they were in the past. 

Feel free to reach out if you want to discuss details.  My son's recruiting experience was mostly Ivy League, Patriot League, D1 mid majors, and D3 engineering schools.  if I don't know the answer, I know who does.

Good luck and welcome (again).

tequila posted:

RJM posted:

My view is a database isn’t worth $2,400. My son and I sat down and came up with a list of fifty colleges of interest where he might be capable of playing. We each took twenty-five names each, looked up their websites gathering names of head coaches and assistant in charge of recruiting along with email and phone number. Then we called each athletic department to verify the information. Even if we had been given the data we would have called to verify. 

The project didn’t take very long. It was done in small chunks over a couple of weeks. My son was invested in the effort. We were working as a team. I didn’t care about his tight schedule. I wanted him to know up front college baseball and academics was going to be a life of tight schedules and time management.

 

Totally agree here but I do think that the database and search tools are worth something, especially to folks who are not as equipped going into it as others. I quite literally knew nothing about the process, was not a college athlete, and neither of my older kids even played sports in high school. I found many of these tools around the same time but I do wish I had found hsbbw and keepplayingbaseball before NCSA.

We used a "guy" for lack of a better word--it was a service, but it was a guy who only did baseball. Yes, he provided access to a database, but he also had weekly contact with my son--what are you doing now, did you fill out this questionnaire, have you considered this school? He helped us put together video and a web site and suggested schools to look at, but only once actually reached out to a coach on my son's behalf. I saw it as more of helping us figure out how to market son and to whom. We paid a one-time fee that covered their services from son's freshman year through his commitment, and I think son still texts with him occasionally.

Like you tequila, I didn't know what I was doing. Do i think we would have ended up in the same place without the guy? Yes probably. Did he make it easier getting there (at least mentally on me)? Yea, I think so.

"N*** analyzed the college roster data of over 1,400 schools across NCAA D1, D2, D3 and NAIA divisions between 2012 and 2017 and found that over 45% of underclassmen athletes are not listed on their college roster the following year."

If we're looking at the same information, the above is a little different than "45% of student-athletes do not return for their sophomore season." Their roster analysis would include medical red-shirts, transfers, cuts, quit playing, quit school, juniors who were drafted, etc.

Still, that % seems really high to me. I'd love to see the raw data.

Thanks Swampboy.

I can see many of you don't like (the service I used which shall not be named).  That was very surprising to me.  I never knew so many folks kept it in such low regard.  But, I am sure many have valid reasons.  Here is where we might agree:

• You can find the same information by yourself, that you could find on (the service I used which shall not be named).
• It might take a little longer do so, but it will be at a savings of at least $2,400.
• The best resource you can use is your own time an effort.  You get what you put in.  
• In the end, NCSA is a business that sells dreams to make its money.
• HSBASEBEBALLWEB is an incredible resource.  There is hardly a question that hasn't been covered.

See...we agree on many things.  Now I will tell you this as a newbie to this site.  Many of you come across as very elitist.  You got to relax.  I get it, you guys have been on here for a while, but geeez, don't pounce on folks like me that just joined.  I didn't come here looking for a fight.  I wrote an article that described my experience in the recruiting process.  Some of you guys came at me with a whada you know? response.  What, you work for (the service I used which shall not be named)? You obviously don't know what you are talking about dude!  Not exactly welcoming.  But many of you, especially swampboy were very welcoming. Thank you.

You got to let people talk about their experiences.  The pros and cons of things.  You can't just jump  on them cause you don't agree with them.  As you know, I will not be deterred by this, but some people might.  Then you will just be talking to yourselves. You don't want that.  I am not an expert, never claimed to be one.  But I have gone through the process with my son for about two years now.  I can also share information. We have learned a few things.  Many from this same site.  I just started posting, but I have been reading your posts for a couple of years.  I was excited to join to share our own experiences, that's all.  

Iowamom23 posted:

tequila posted:

RJM posted:

My view is a database isn’t worth $2,400. My son and I sat down and came up with a list of fifty colleges of interest where he might be capable of playing. We each took twenty-five names each, looked up their websites gathering names of head coaches and assistant in charge of recruiting along with email and phone number. Then we called each athletic department to verify the information. Even if we had been given the data we would have called to verify. 

The project didn’t take very long. It was done in small chunks over a couple of weeks. My son was invested in the effort. We were working as a team. I didn’t care about his tight schedule. I wanted him to know up front college baseball and academics was going to be a life of tight schedules and time management.

 

Totally agree here but I do think that the database and search tools are worth something, especially to folks who are not as equipped going into it as others. I quite literally knew nothing about the process, was not a college athlete, and neither of my older kids even played sports in high school. I found many of these tools around the same time but I do wish I had found hsbbw and keepplayingbaseball before NCSA.

We used a "guy" for lack of a better word--it was a service, but it was a guy who only did baseball. Yes, he provided access to a database, but he also had weekly contact with my son--what are you doing now, did you fill out this questionnaire, have you considered this school? He helped us put together video and a web site and suggested schools to look at, but only once actually reached out to a coach on my son's behalf. I saw it as more of helping us figure out how to market son and to whom. We paid a one-time fee that covered their services from son's freshman year through his commitment, and I think son still texts with him occasionally.

Like you tequila, I didn't know what I was doing. Do i think we would have ended up in the same place without the guy? Yes probably. Did he make it easier getting there (at least mentally on me)? Yea, I think so.

My son was just connected to a "guy" who provides a similar service.  On the website, they say they are not a recruiting service, but can help with various things ranging from setting up a recruiting website with video, etc to organizing campus tours geared toward visiting and meeting with coaches at schools outside of the player's region.  In my mind, I'm not sure I see much of a difference between these services and a "recruiting service" but maybe there is.  I'm generally hesitant to pay for anything that resembles a recruiting service (based on the reasons often discussed here), but I guess I'm curious if there are some legitimate services that are worth paying for and at what point in the process?  I'm thinking it may be too late in the process for us to maximize value from any type of service (even just using the "guy"), since we are halfway through his rising Senior summer and he has received some interest on his own already. 

Within the last month I had a private conversation with a poster about using “a guy” as opposed to a service. The poster explained he’s from the south. “The guy” has contacts with Ivies and other HA’s in the northeast. 

If “the guy” has direct contacts and can presell on behalf of the player it can have value. But everything I know about services is providing information and spamming the hell out of college coaches. 

An important part of preselling a player seeing and assessing the player. It’s why a travel player’s coach is the best person for preselling. 

Just curious, if a service contacts a coach without ever seeing the player on the field how does he have any credibility with the coach? 

In my opinion, the perfect summation of the whole recruiting service issue from RJM:

"Just curious, if a service contacts a coach without ever seeing the player on the field how does he have any credibility with the coach?"

Having said that, perhaps a service that just help provides appropriate contact numbers, helps with video and stays on top of the player to make sure he's following through may have some value to some families.  I can see that, as long as the cost and the promises made pass the common sense test.

As I have posted in the past, we have had a positive experience with a Recruiting Service who has extensive coaching relationships and watches each one of his clients play prior to taking them on as clients.  He has watched my son play over a dozen times and has done a great job of representing my son to multiple college coaches.  I agree that travel coaches are a great resource and are instrumental in the recruiting process.  My son's travel team was a well-respected, nationally ranked program but the coach did not have extensive relationships outside of our area so that is one of the reasons we paid for the extra help.  Also, his coach did an outstanding job when coaches reached out to him but he didn't reach out to any coaches on my son's behalf.  Not all recruiting services are the same... nor are all travel coaches in my experience.